Full Size vs Mid Size

[LostWoods]

So from your perspective / experience which model years do you recommend looking for?

Third gen Ram, 2004-2007 (I think early 2007 but that might have been the switch year) is my pick but at that age, it will be hard to find a clean one. After that they got the 6.7 with the EGR and all that fun stuff. I got out of there in 2006 so really can't comment on the 6.7 but with as durable as the 5.9L was, I can't imagine wanting the newer engine unless I'm towing massive amounts of weight that necessitate it.

Otherwise, I can't say that newer diesels warrant the investment unless you're towing regularly or towing BIG. All the emissions requirements killed durability and you actually need to use the power to make the diesel tax worth the hit. I wouldn't hesitate to buy a gas truck if towing is just an occasional thing because the used fleet market really drives those prices down.

 

[LostWoods]

Only if you put the time in to prevent KDP. It's a cheap kit, and can be done in the driveway.

And keep in mind that the 5.9 is a farm tractor engine. If you have fillings in your teeth, or working ear drums, you won't after owning one for long.

The 12V yeah. The 24V injection pump trucks were much better and the 24V common rail was like butter.

 

[Jrodrigues1278]

Only if you put the time in to prevent KDP. It's a cheap kit, and can be done in the driveway.

And keep in mind that the 5.9 is a farm tractor engine. If you have fillings in your teeth, or working ear drums, you won't after owning one for long.

KDP?

 

[Wallygator]

I think I have decided and I am going to start my search. Thank you to everyone for your insight and opinions. Here is my conclusions.

Since I live in the Northern NJ, 15 minutes out of NYC, trails are not in my backyard. So a lot of driving on road will need to be done to get to trails. At this point the diesel makes sense. Realistically any major US trip will also be 2k-6K mile round trip. Places like Colorado, Georgia, Maine, Virginia, etc. MPG and longevity will be key.

Full size. As much as I want a JTR, the comfort for my family on long trips with their Medical history and additional space is a must.That with added bonus of having my son’s service dog one day in the cab with us to help him stay calm on longer trips just makes sense.


Payload, need to be above 3K as a minimum. I will use this truck for a new venture in addition to overlanding. Details on that; another time.

Towing, needs to be able tow at least 10K. Various reasons, but mostly for trailers of all kinds. From Jeeps to cargo to base camp.

Easily accessible parts both nationally and internationally. Don’t plan on taking it anywhere international for many years. By the time I do, low sulfur diesel should not be an issue. I am willing to address that later down the road.

Brand new full size trucks are way costly, I priced a Ram 2500 Laramie to almost 80K before mods. I would rather invest that in venture. At 80K I could have a customer excursion built out of a super duty.

So what am I thinking?

Gen 4 (or pristine 3) Ram 2500/3500 Cummins

Thoughts comments concerns?

Yeah you can get a Ram for way cheaper than that! You don't need half the crap that comes with a Laramie. Buy a Tradesman with a few options. Check out this dealership, they will pick you up at the airport for free. Then drive home. Looks like you need a one ton with what you have listed. Buy a 3500 IMO. One ton and done.

20 New RAM 3500 Trucks for Sale in Caldwell, ID | Dennis Dillon CDJR

 

[LostWoods]

KDP?

"Killer Dowel Pin"... It's a problem on the old 12V engine in the second gen trucks where an alignment pin on the front of the engine comes loose under the timing cover. If it falls to the bottom of the case, it's generally no harm, no foul... typically though it will get caught in the gears and things go *crack*.

it's not a thing on the 24V engines in the third gen so you shouldn't have anything to worry about.

 

[Jrodrigues1278]

Yes I know about that. I read about it, just didn’t know the abbreviation.

 

[MidOH]

New Fords hover around $44k gas, 55k diesel. Also Ford has the 7.3l gas engine now.

If you go Dodge. Make sure that the seating feels ''right''. My Dodge lacks the Fords telescopic steering. It's seat would be superior, if the pedals were 3" further away, and the steering wheel 3" closer. Advantage Ford. And price out the black base model grill if you get anything other than base. It looks way nicer than the chrome. Or maybe find someone to trade grills with online.

 

[Billiebob]

Drive them both, Ford & Dodge. Fords ride like Lincolns. Dodges ride like buckboards. always have. Hit a few speed bumps with each. Take the wife and kids. You'll never buy a Dodge after comparing the ride.

On the diesel vs gas thing. You are talking about towing 10K pounds and trips of 5K miles. That is where diesels shine. Lots of miles, lots of load. Definitely stick with the diesel option.

 

[DevilDodge]

If you want 3k payload as a minimum you have to get the 3500.

My 2500 Tradesman has 2998...it is the 392 Hemi. You say you want a diesel...that makes the payload just over 2k

3500 SRW with the diesel will give you the 3k.

Here is mine with about 3k in bricks in the bed

You say you want yours loaded too...well a 2500 will not give you your 3k. But as you can see it can handle 3k

 

[4wheelspulling]

Vance,
I do appreciate your responce. As for the Excursion, I have looked, actually for a few years now for a used one. The problems I usually find with used excursions are:

Poor Service records / Rusted floorboards / 13” “lift” kits / Don’t want a V10 / 7.3 Ridiculous mileages or over priced / 6.0 bulletproof (good thing) but usually heavily modified / etc.

I originally was looking at a Gladiator Rubicon for several reasons, but I was concerned with interior space. I used a the Ram version of it as a reference, starting with the Power Wagen as a comparison.

I would love a new fully loaded Ram but at 80k+.... I doubt it. Yes I know I can get one for 50k.

I appreciate the information Vance and if I made it seem like NEW was the only option for me, that is not the case. The purpose of this thread was to decide what would be more appropriate, full or mid. Everyone has been helpful a small Ihave appreciated every comment. Full size seems to be what will be right for my family.

The rest of the conversation has been icing on the cake, great information, great insights, informative opinions and I thank You and everyone for all of it.

....... with all of that being said, what would you recommend and why?

Jrodrigues1278,
For about a month now, there has been a 2002 Ford Excursion, 4x4 for sale on Seattle CL. It does have 136,000 miles on it and the 6.0 L. Motor. Yes, the 6.0 L Diesel motor! My guess you could buy this for $8000. with some dealing, spend $3000. to fix the EGR issues and have a vehicle for a long time.There are many write ups on how to fix the The 6.0L ills. Buy it, drive it home like it is, make a fun trip out of it! Get home, fix the EGR for dependability, mod it as your need and family want.

My Dodge 2500 Cummins 4x4 manual trans truck is a 99’ with a 2002’ motor. As stated above magazines read that 2004’ - 7’ are the best years. See FourWheeler Magazine. As to parts overseas, remember Cummins is used around the world in commercial applications. You can get parts from almost any major cities in the world! My motor in my truck is an 2002’ industrial 5.9 in my truck now! My next choice would be, any Ford truck, Super Duty crew cab or Excursion, 4x4 with the Turbo 7.3 Diesel. F350 or newer Super Duty F250. Just remember, the Crew Cab trucks with an 8’ box take a mile to turn around!
You may not like to work on your vehicles or can’t because of where you live in housing, and have someone else that you can have do all your work. If you keep the maintenance up on an older truck, they can be be just as dependable as a new truck. I would not buy any new vehicle right now that I see, that is just me! Vance.

 

[Jrodrigues1278]

Jrodrigues1278,
For about a month now, there has been a 2002 Ford Excursion, 4x4 for sale on Seattle CL. It does have 136,000 miles on it and the 6.0 L. Motor. Yes, the 6.0 L Diesel motor! My guess you could buy this for $8000. with some dealing, spend $3000. to fix the EGR issues and have a vehicle for a long time.There are many write ups on how to fix the The 6.0L ills. Buy it, drive it home like it is, make a fun trip out of it! Get home, fix the EGR for dependability, mod it as your need and family want.

My Dodge 2500 Cummins 4x4 manual trans truck is a 99’ with a 2002’ motor. As stated above magazines read that 2004’ - 7’ are the best years. See FourWheeler Magazine. As to parts overseas, remember Cummins is used around the world in commercial applications. You can get parts from almost any major cities in the world! My motor in my truck is an 2002’ industrial 5.9 in my truck now! My next choice would be, any Ford truck, Super Duty crew cab or Excursion, 4x4 with the Turbo 7.3 Diesel. F350 or newer Super Duty F250. Just remember, the Crew Cab trucks with an 8’ box take a mile to turn around!
You may not like to work on your vehicles or can’t because of where you live in housing, and have someone else that you can have do all your work. If you keep the maintenance up on an older truck, they can be be just as dependable as a new truck. I would not buy any new vehicle right now that I see, that is just me! Vance.

Vance,
I actually am pretty handy around vehicles. Unfortunately where I currently live I don’t have the room to undertake large projects, but maintenance is possible.

Seems like you have the Holy Grail, 12v cummins with a manual trans. I have been going back and forth about it. I am willing to sacrifice the 1000 pound difference in payload if a nice 2500 comes along. The rear coils are a plus over the leafs in a a 3500. So...

A 2500 or 3500 MEGA Cab with or without ramboxes. After watching a few videos showcasing the different interiors; the mega cab has the unique features in which the middle back seat is not shorter (don’t know how to describe it better), it’s straight across like a bench seat. However the seat behind the driver seat, once folded down with the extra space behind (mega part) makes a great sized platform for my son’s service dog (coming soon). Possibly evan do a delete and have a platform permanently there. Who knows... a lot to think about but in the end I think with everyone help (extremely appreciated) I think I have come to a solution that works and hits my goals.

Thanks everyone!

 

[ChambersFamily]

If you want 3k payload as a minimum you have to get the 3500.

My 2500 Tradesman has 2998...it is the 392 Hemi. You say you want a diesel...that makes the payload just over 2k

3500 SRW with the diesel will give you the 3k.

Here is mine with about 3k in bricks in the bedView attachment 157182

You say you want yours loaded too...well a 2500 will not give you your 3k. But as you can see it can handle 3k

Yeah that was a odd lesson for me to learn as well... I've always had 1 ton trucks. So payload really wasn't ever a concern. But along with a 1 ton... dually... lifted... it rode like a tank. So this time around I waned a 2500 for the coil rear end, and a cummins for the longevity. BUT... that engine weighs 6000 lbs! a 3/4 ton being a class 2 truck and can't exceed 10k gvwr... that only left me 2k! Just one of those things. The truck can handle more a LOT more. But if something SHOULD happen and I am exceeding, it would be bad times...

I do miss my 12v dually though... she was a runner for sure

 

[Jrodrigues1278]

Yeah that was a odd lesson for me to learn as well... I've always had 1 ton trucks. So payload really wasn't ever a concern. But along with a 1 ton... dually... lifted... it rode like a tank. So this time around I waned a 2500 for the coil rear end, and a cummins for the longevity. BUT... that engine weighs 6000 lbs! a 3/4 ton being a class 2 truck and can't exceed 10k gvwr... that only left me 2k! Just one of those things. The truck can handle more a LOT more. But if something SHOULD happen and I am exceeding, it would be bad times...

I do miss my 12v dually though... she was a runner for sure

I agree a DRW 1 Ton is too much for trails, but is do miss my dually!

 

[ChambersFamily]

I agree a DRW 1 Ton is too much for trails, but is do miss my dually!

Ohhh man, that picture was a rough day. The paint was maybe a few months old, and I was carving up sagebrush all the way there. Let alone the rocks and such I have to go over because there was no going around. I remember at one point, I was in 4low in 1st (4:10 ratio) on my breaks going down a section of rock.... I shouldn't have been on... and suddenly my air conditioning goes from my vents to defrost...and I instantly knew I lost vacuum. Seconds later no breaks! It only lasted for about 3-5 seconds until the vacuum pump caught up but like all things it felt like minutes when your just hanging on... Also in those minutes following... I knew why a high flow vacuum pump might be a good idea

Not to mention prior events before all this where I stopped by a gas station only to be told they were out of diesel... Trying to limp to Bend on fumes, to of course run out of fuel 5 miles from town. Priming the system on the side of the highway once I got fuel. After ALLLL this, I'm headed home, I get on it and the truck falls on it's face... runs fine other wise, but any heavy foot, It wants to die... I drive 5 hours home with no drama. Setup my fuel pressure gauge... only to find out the lift pump went and it was running on the little bit of pressure the injection pump created.... impressive. My '19 would have non of that nonsense hahah

In the end, it was a long day

 

[Jrodrigues1278]

Ohhh man, that picture was a rough day. The paint was maybe a few months old, and I was carving up sagebrush all the way there. Let alone the rocks and such I have to go over because there was no going around. I remember at one point, I was in 4low in 1st (4:10 ratio) on my breaks going down a section of rock.... I shouldn't have been on... and suddenly my air conditioning goes from my vents to defrost...and I instantly knew I lost vacuum. Seconds later no breaks! It only lasted for about 3-5 seconds until the vacuum pump caught up but like all things it felt like minutes when your just hanging on... Also in those minutes following... I knew why a high flow vacuum pump might be a good idea

Not to mention prior events before all this where I stopped by a gas station only to be told they were out of diesel... Trying to limp to Bend on fumes, to of course run out of fuel 5 miles from town. Priming the system on the side of the highway once I got fuel. After ALLLL this, I'm headed home, I get on it and the truck falls on it's face... runs fine other wise, but any heavy foot, It wants to die... I drive 5 hours home with no drama. Setup my fuel pressure gauge... only to find out the lift pump went and it was running on the little bit of pressure the injection pump created.... impressive. My '19 would have non of that nonsense hahah

In the end, it was a long day

Sounds like the time I blew my turbos and the last time I saw my dually was like this ... long story for another day

 

[4wheelspulling]

Yeah that was a odd lesson for me to learn as well... I've always had 1 ton trucks. So payload really wasn't ever a concern. But along with a 1 ton... dually... lifted... it rode like a tank. So this time around I waned a 2500 for the coil rear end, and a cummins for the longevity. BUT... that engine weighs 6000 lbs! a 3/4 ton being a class 2 truck and can't exceed 10k gvwr... that only left me 2k! Just one of those things. The truck can handle more a LOT more. But if something SHOULD happen and I am exceeding, it would be bad times...

I do miss my 12v dually though... she was a runner for sure

ChambersFamily,
Must be a misprint on the weight of a 5.9 Cummins. Try more like 1500 lbs.with all the assessories! Vance.

 

[4wheelspulling]

Jrodrigues1278,
If you decide to go newer, and want a manual transmission, in a Dodge Cummins truck, 2018 was the last year in 2500-3500 trucks. Vance.