What do you think are really good tires for most off road ventures

[bgenlvtex]

I'd say you are certainly qualified to give excellent advise on the subject. My point is that when I buy a tire I have no control over who or what puts that tire on my wheel. Customers are not even allowed in the shop area. I have to trust that the owner of the tire company has trained his employees properly on the inspection of the wheel and properly installs it on said wheel. It's like I said before, I am a Architect, I design and draw the plans by a various assortment of laws and codes. After the plans leave my hands I have no control over the quality of the build or who builds it. I know my job but I have to hope everybody below me knows their job and follows through.
Anyway on the tire issue you originally posted.
I cant be concerned about the issues you brought up. No one can, if the service provider dosent do a proper job of controlling his own facility I cat do anything about that. I will say that if he does everything by the book, on every tire he mounts on a wheel, he will go broke. Like I said, the tire has a life time warranty policy and I'm too old to worry about whether the dealership follows all the rules of the trade. They will do what they do !!
Have a nice week end John

Some people don't have access to professionally run organizations in many areas of commerce, I agree. You can however control what they do by simply voting with your wallet, and you can discover quickly and easily if the people you are trading with know what they are doing or if they are hacks.

Lets pretend for a moment you are shopping for tires:

You're talking to the salesman, one other customer is in the sales/waiting area, a 1/2 ton pickup is on the rack in the shop, you hear an impact wrench cycle 5 times and Skip pokes his head in the door and says "You're ready to go Ma'am". You know right then they don't torque wheels correctly.

You're walking into the tire store and there is a vehicle with obviously fresh new tires on it, is the valve hardware new or does it all appear oxidized? If oxidized, just go to another store right now, valve hardware is the most common failure in passenger and light trucks, they are also dirt cheap, cheapest insurance you'll ever buy.

You're talking to the salesman, and he's showing you a tire, you say "What are these red and yellow dots right above the bead about?". If he cannot explain to you that they are weight and uniformity indicators, there is some chance (and it's a good one) that will will have vibration problems with those tires for life.

Still you're with the salesman, "Hey I'm going to buy a torque wrench in case I need to swap my wheels myself, what brand do you guys use?" If he says "ehhhhhh, I don't know, something, something torque stick" you know you are dealing with a schlock.

I could go on for some time, but I think you get the point. Go in smart, know something about what you are buying, you don't have to give them directions to find out if they are professionals. Don't resign yourself to getting what you get, you're paying for it, get what you paid for and that is a job done correctly.

Doing it right really doesn't take any longer than doing it wrong, but doing it wrong will certainly take more time to correct it. Doing it wrong will put you out of business quicker than doing it right.

Everyone in the tire business who ever had dealings with me on the subject of quality service has heard me say (as they defend substandard service) " When you accept mediocrity it becomes the new standard"

 

[Lanlubber In Remembrance]

Some people don't have access to professionally run organizations in many areas of commerce, I agree. You can however control what they do by simply voting with your wallet, and you can discover quickly and easily if the people you are trading with know what they are doing or if they are hacks.

Lets pretend for a moment you are shopping for tires:

You're talking to the salesman, one other customer is in the sales/waiting area, a 1/2 ton pickup is on the rack in the shop, you hear an impact wrench cycle 5 times and Skip pokes his head in the door and says "You're ready to go Ma'am". You know right then they don't torque wheels correctly.

You're walking into the tire store and there is a vehicle with obviously fresh new tires on it, is the valve hardware new or does it all appear oxidized? If oxidized, just go to another store right now, valve hardware is the most common failure in passenger and light trucks, they are also dirt cheap, cheapest insurance you'll ever buy.

You're talking to the salesman, and he's showing you a tire, you say "What are these red and yellow dots right above the bead about?". If he cannot explain to you that they are weight and uniformity indicators, there is some chance (and it's a good one) that will will have vibration problems with those tires for life.

Still you're with the salesman, "Hey I'm going to buy a torque wrench in case I need to swap my wheels myself, what brand do you guys use?" If he says "ehhhhhh, I don't know, something, something torque stick" you know you are dealing with a schlock.

I could go on for some time, but I think you get the point. Go in smart, know something about what you are buying, you don't have to give them directions to find out if they are professionals. Don't resign yourself to getting what you get, you're paying for it, get what you paid for and that is a job done correctly.

Doing it right really doesn't take any longer than doing it wrong, but doing it wrong will certainly take more time to correct it. Doing it wrong will put you out of business quicker than doing it right.

Everyone in the tire business who ever had dealings with me on the subject of quality service has heard me say (as they defend substandard service) " When you accept mediocrity it becomes the new standard"

Bruce, I think I may be a little ahead of some of the people you have encountered. Example. I don't look to see if new valve stems have been installed because I don't leave that up to the tire dealer, I tell him I want new valve stems. secondly I usually stand out side the door way and watch the mounting and balancing of my tires to see if I like the way they do it.

Then I watch them install the tires on the car so I will know if they are installing the lug nuts properly in a triangular fashion with a final run around the circle of nuts. Because I am older than a lot of people still driving , I generally ask them to install my lug nuts with a torque wrench instead of an air gun running them down to the point of cracking the mounting hole. I'm just not strong enough to try changing a tire with 200 pounds of torque applied to each nut and I wouldn't feel safe it that was done. Torque to spec's are my instructions, not the shop Forman's.

Remember I told you I was a race car builder and driver, a bad wheel install is something we try to avoid and did when I was able to do it myself. I have seen shops in the past do what you said, put one nut at a time on and running it all the way down then going to the next nut in the circle and do the same thing without seating the wheel on the hub properly. Yes even if you cant see them, but you know they are working on your car you can listen for the sounds of improper wheel installment to some extent. Usually you will here the first three being installed and then another two then a series of five check nut blasts. I don't know how many other people bother to worry, I don't worry when I know my dealer. In my case I do know him and I know his standards.

About the colored dots you mentioned. The tire on display and the tire that is put on your car are never the same tire. I have had a tire in the past that had balancing problems, at least once I can remember taking the car back several time for a bad or unacceptable vibration. Finally tell the dealer it was not acceptable and he personally inspected the tire and wheel he replaced the tire with a new one which ended the problem. I am very sensitive to tire vibrations and it irritates me to the point I wont drive a car with unknown vibrations. For me it is usually a mechanical problem or wheel alignment, but I get it fixed before anything happens.

I guess it boils downto knowing your vehicle and paying close attention to sounds and feel of your car. If it's not right start looking cause it isn't supposed to be that way.
Thank for all your concerns about my tires, I hope I still have all my wit and able to use my knowledge of mechanics to keep me out of trouble.

 

[bgenlvtex]

Bruce, I think I may be a little ahead of some of the people you have encountered. Example. I don't look to see if new valve stems have been installed because I don't leave that up to the tire dealer, I tell him I want new valve stems. secondly I usually stand out side the door way and watch the mounting and balancing of my tires to see if I like the way they do it.

Then I watch them install the tires on the car so I will know if they are installing the lug nuts properly in a triangular fashion with a final run around the circle of nuts. Because I am older than a lot of people still driving , I generally ask them to install my lug nuts with a torque wrench instead of an air gun running them down to the point of cracking the mounting hole. I'm just not strong enough to try changing a tire with 200 pounds of torque applied to each nut and I wouldn't feel safe it that was done. Torque to spec's are my instructions, not the shop Forman's.

Remember I told you I was a race car builder and driver, a bad wheel install is something we try to avoid and did when I was able to do it myself. I have seen shops in the past do what you said, put one nut at a time on and running it all the way down then going to the next nut in the circle and do the same thing without seating the wheel on the hub properly. Yes even if you cant see them, but you know they are working on your car you can listen for the sounds of improper wheel installment to some extent. Usually you will here the first three being installed and then another two then a series of five check nut blasts. I don't know how many other people bother to worry, I don't worry when I know my dealer. In my case I do know him and I know his standards.

About the colored dots you mentioned. The tire on display and the tire that is put on your car are never the same tire. I have had a tire in the past that had balancing problems, at least once I can remember taking the car back several time for a bad or unacceptable vibration. Finally tell the dealer it was not acceptable and he personally inspected the tire and wheel he replaced the tire with a new one which ended the problem. I am very sensitive to tire vibrations and it irritates me to the point I wont drive a car with unknown vibrations. For me it is usually a mechanical problem or wheel alignment, but I get it fixed before anything happens.

I guess it boils downto knowing your vehicle and paying close attention to sounds and feel of your car. If it's not right start looking cause it isn't supposed to be that way.
Thank for all your concerns about my tires, I hope I still have all my wit and able to use my knowledge of mechanics to keep me out of trouble.

Good, good, your previous posts suggested that you just sort of let the tire guy have his way with you, glad that you are on top of it.

 

[Lanlubber In Remembrance]

Good, good, your previous posts suggested that you just sort of let the tire guy have his way with you, glad that you are on top of it.

Yes, I meant the people I use I don't have to worry about , yet still I look in when they let me. I usually just stand just outside the entrance door to the balancing machine and the car is on the lift next to it. That's where I was when I saw that a tire they mounted a few years ago had a bent rim. The guy was balancing the new tire on a bent rim and I could see it had a wobble. I reported that to the shop boss and I never saw the guy there again. Sooo ??? You cant be too careful I know that.

 

[BamSilverado15]

This has been very interesting so far. I have checked on many suggestions and found some interesting info. One, you cant go by prices to determine quality based on use by buyers. Some of the so called better tires (BFG's, Goodyear) have very poor ratings buy owners of the tire. Several of the cheaper tires have very good ratings by their owners. I think I have found a tire no one has mentioned here so far and would like to know if anyone else has used them. They are Mildstar Patagonia brand. They have a 4.6 overall rating @ Discount Tire sales with all users. I'm looking at 265/75R/16 @ $138.00 each and because I want 5, there is a $100 discount. (discount comes because if I order them now they are out of stock so I will have to wait) I hope there is an OB'er out there who has some knowledge of this tire. It looks promising to me.

https://www.discounttiredirect.com/buy-tires/milestar-patagonia-m-t

New to the Overland world and had this same question myself. I also have been looking at the patagonia m/t and also the falken wildpeak m/t. The guy on the Autoedits youtube channel just put a set of 38" patagonias on his JKU. He seems enthused about them so hopefully we can see a real world review soon. Most people I know have also ran KO2's and duratracs, but some have started using the Atturo brand. Seem to work out pretty well as long as you rotate they last.

 

[Sasquatch SC]

New to the Overland world and had this same question myself. I also have been looking at the patagonia m/t and also the falken wildpeak m/t. The guy on the Autoedits youtube channel just put a set of 38" patagonias on his JKU. He seems enthused about them so hopefully we can see a real world review soon. Most people I know have also ran KO2's and duratracs, but some have started using the Atturo brand. Seem to work out pretty well as long as you rotate they last.

I'm guessing from your handle you are wheeling a Silverado? Several years ago I had a 2003 Silverado that I ran Mickey's on and they were really good. I liked them a lot, but they did not like the pavement. I go on a lot of adventures with @JButtress and he wheels a '17 Silverado that he just put BFG's on. I haven't heard any complaints with his decision. I think a lot of the tire decision is based on the rig they are going on.

 

[BamSilverado15]

I'm guessing from your handle you are wheeling a Silverado? Several years ago I had a 2003 Silverado that I ran Mickey's on and they were really good. I liked them a lot, but they did not like the pavement. I go on a lot of adventures with @JButtress and he wheels a '17 Silverado that he just put BFG's on. I haven't heard any complaints with his decision. I think a lot of the tire decision is based on the rig they are going on.

Yes sir. It's actually my first truck. Always been more of a sports car person, but had friends who wheeled with 4runners and jeeps. Finally decided to get a truck and once I started seeing these overland adventures on youtube, it made me wanna give it a go. I found OB this morning and jumped in.

As far as the tires go, I do like the BFG's but cost is a bit much IMO. I like the FALKEN Wildpeak AT/3 as a good option as well. Probably in another year, my tires will be low enough for me to finally do an upgrade.

Have you been through any trails in the Charlotte Area or west of there?

 

[Sasquatch SC]

Yes sir. It's actually my first truck. Always been more of a sports car person, but had friends who wheeled with 4runners and jeeps. Finally decided to get a truck and once I started seeing these overland adventures on youtube, it made me wanna give it a go. I found OB this morning and jumped in.

As far as the tires go, I do like the BFG's but cost is a bit much IMO. I like the FALKEN Wildpeak AT/3 as a good option as well. Probably in another year, my tires will be low enough for me to finally do an upgrade.

Have you been through any trails in the Charlotte Area or west of there?

Yeah. You could definitely say that. My rig has been dubbed the Appalachia Wander Wagon because it is rare that more than a week goes by without me exploring some trails. We are doing a rally point this weekend, you can find it here. It is going to be a tame one of mostly hard pack gravel tracks.

 

[MidOH]

I'd say you are certainly qualified to give excellent advise on the subject. My point is that when I buy a tire I have no control over who or what puts that tire on my wheel. Customers are not even allowed in the shop area. I have to trust that the owner of the tire company has trained his employees properly on the inspection of the wheel and properly installs it on said wheel. It's like I said before, I am a Architect, I design and draw the plans by a various assortment of laws and codes. After the plans leave my hands I have no control over the quality of the build or who builds it. I know my job but I have to hope everybody below me knows their job and follows through.
Anyway on the tire issue you originally posted.
I cant be concerned about the issues you brought up. No one can, if the service provider dosent do a proper job of controlling his own facility I cat do anything about that. I will say that if he does everything by the book, on every tire he mounts on a wheel, he will go broke. Like I said, the tire has a life time warranty policy and I'm too old to worry about whether the dealership follows all the rules of the trade. They will do what they do !!
Have a nice week end John

In that case. Just bring them your bare wheels. Then you're only relying on them to clean the rims, soap, and seal the tires.

You can mount and torque them properly at home.

 

[MidOH]

They screw up balancing most of the time anyways, so I don't even worry about it. I lost most of my weights on my Cooper STT's. Never noticed a thing.

Some poor kid balanced the slicks on my Mustangs wheels. Lol. I had to peel them all off. Just line up the dot with the valve stem, those tires will be gone in 2 days.

 

[JButtress]

I'm guessing from your handle you are wheeling a Silverado? Several years ago I had a 2003 Silverado that I ran Mickey's on and they were really good. I liked them a lot, but they did not like the pavement. I go on a lot of adventures with @JButtress and he wheels a '17 Silverado that he just put BFG's on. I haven't heard any complaints with his decision. I think a lot of the tire decision is based on the rig they are going on.

I'm loving my BFGoodrich KO2's for sure

 

[Lanlubber In Remembrance]

In that case. Just bring them your bare wheels. Then you're only relying on them to clean the rims, soap, and seal the tires.

You can mount and torque them properly at home.

The idea is good if you have two sets of wheels. I have to drive my rig to the tire dealer with the only set of wheels I have. LOL

 

[BamSilverado15]

I'm loving my BFGoodrich KO2's for sure

Glad to see another Silverado in the Charlotte area. How much work have you done to your rig? Have you found some good stuff in the aftermarket, or are you getting creative and DIY your stuff?

 

[MOAK]

I see that all the time also???? I live in Washington and similar to Oregon average 64 inches of rain a year, so wet is normal. Having run BFGs ATs on 3 different rigs and now KO2s on the wife's 4Runner my experience has been nothing but normal tire performance. Nothing amazing, nothing horrible. I wonder if some of it is just peoples driving habits that live in areas that don't get a lot of rain? Much like when Portland gets hit with 3 inches of snow

To answer your question, yes, it is peoples terrible driving habits. I see a lot of folks complain about a certain brand of tire, ( any brand, pick one) that has horrible performance in adverse conditions- rain, snow, patchy ice, etc... hey, if ya drive like an idiot you’re gonna rate any tire horrible.. I’m currently running BFGs and lots of people complain about horrible performance on wet roads.. hmmm, I’ve never broken traction with them on wet roads or snow covered roads, and no, I don’t drive like an old man, I drive normal and adjust for conditions

 

[JButtress]

Glad to see another Silverado in the Charlotte area. How much work have you done to your rig? Have you found some good stuff in the aftermarket, or are you getting creative and DIY your stuff?

I'm not really a DIY guy unfortunately....I wish I was haha. I have the below so far on my Silverado

2" leveling kit
BFGoodrich KO2's 275/75/18
KBVooDoo Bed Rack
Hi Vis Overland Crag2 Roof Top Tent
Decked USA drawer system for the bed.
Midland GMRS radio

 

[Lanlubber In Remembrance]

I'm not really a DIY guy unfortunately....I wish I was haha. I have the below so far on my Silverado

2" leveling kit
BFGoodrich KO2's 275/75/18
KBVooDoo Bed Rack
Hi Vis Overland Crag2 Roof Top Tent
Decked USA drawer system for the bed.
Midland GMRS radio

What's that thang behind you? Lol

 

[JButtress]

What's that thang behind you? Lol

Oh in the picture? I used to have a military trailer with rooftop tent on it. But I sold it

 

[MrCoffee]

Personally, I like the General AT series. Huge fan of the AT-2, which I have had on my Jeep LJ, Escape, Jeep YJ, and the current project F-150 will be getting a set of the AT-X sneakers all the way around.
My Outland rigs are our daily drivers, and until recently my wife was doing 70 miles a day, each way to work. The AT-2 had no problems with winter weather. I tend to rotate them every oil change, which
help with the wear, a lot.

 

[Lanlubber In Remembrance]

Oh in the picture? I used to have a military trailer with rooftop tent on it. But I sold it

They are good to have and free up a ton of space on your rig.

 

[Jeep jeeep]

Excluding extreme rock crawling or mud bogging, what tires do you thing perform the best for most on-off road conditions in all weather situations and for technical trails as well. I am about to buy 5 new tires for my LRD2 in preparation for my fall, winter, spring adventures. My trips will be in NM, Arizona, Nevada, Colorado, Wyoming, Utah, Washington, and Organ. I will be on paved roads as little as possible but unfortunately I cant just go anywhere I want so whatever road is available for travel will be what I use in my wonderings.
Lanlubber Jim

We've been running Micky Thompson mtz p3's on a '17 JKU and have zero complaints. Have about 20k on them, unfortunately more street then dirt, and just past about 50% wear. Excellent traction on all surfaces including wet pavement. You may want to take a look at them.