What do YOU consider "capable"?

[m_lars]

There's a manufacturer that has introduced a new vehicle model with the same name as a discontinued model. On The 'Gram it seems to get nearly universal scorn. Doesn't live up to the name, capable of picking up groceries, etc. Funny thing is, it is better than the old in almost every metric and stock vs. stock will be (in my opinion) considerably more capable the old one.

So, this got me thinking, what do people think makes a vehicle "capable"? Is there something that makes it incapable? Is there a line, once crossed, makes a vehicle capable? Owners of different marques have different opinions of why there chosen brand is more capable than yours. Obviously there's no right or wrong here and I definitely feel if it's capable of doing what you want it to it's capable, but this is an intriguing question to me.

I admit this could turn ugly and that is not my intention... Please keep remarks civil.

 

[TXJeep]

Ford Bronco????


I think just about everything can be made capable, with a minimum IMO being a 2 speed transfer case. Some are just a little better out the box.

 

[tjZ06]

Ford Bronco????

I was going to say the same.


As for the actual question, my answer is "it depends." People certainly felt like the KL Jeep Cherokees weren't capable enough and didn't properly carry the XJ's torch when they came out, most still feel that way. The KL is a "better vehicle" in nearly every way... but can't touch an XJ when the trail gets a little tougher. You could say the same when the Grands went IFS (WK) or IFS/IRS (WK2). I've had a 5.7 Hemi WK2 and it was a better vehicle than my WJ in EVERY way, and with the air suspension and such wasn't "bad" offroad, but again can't tackle the same trails my WJ can.

The reality is manufacturers have to make money and make vehicles that appeal to *most* people. Generally these days that means IFS/IRS at the cost of more "hardcore" offroad ability. The few folks left that "must" have a solid axle buy Wranglers (or 3/4-1 ton Ford/RAM trucks).


I think my idea of capable is a bit more extreme than even the typical Overlander, and with the Wrangler on the market (and Gladiator) I understand why most manufacturers don't bother trying to hit that mark.

-TJ

 

[m_lars]

Ford Bronco????


I think just about everything can be made capable, with a minimum IMO being a 2 speed transfer case. Some are just a little better out the box.

Low range is a big one.

 

[Charles M]

Obviously there's no right or wrong here and I definitely feel if it's capable of doing what you want it to it's capable, but this is an intriguing question to me.

I admit this could turn ugly and that is not my intention... Please keep remarks civil.

I think you summed it up when you said the above...

But, if it does what YOU want it is good... If it doesn't do what you want then fix it or get something that does...

 

[m_lars]

I was going to say the same.


As for the actual question, my answer is "it depends." People certainly felt like the KL Jeep Cherokees weren't capable enough and didn't properly carry the XJ's torch when they came out, most still feel that way. The KL is a "better vehicle" in nearly every way... but can't touch an XJ when the trail gets a little tougher. You could say the same when the Grands went IFS (WK) or IFS/IRS (WK2). I've had a 5.7 Hemi WK2 and it was a better vehicle than my WJ in EVERY way, and with the air suspension and such wasn't "bad" offroad, but again can't tackle the same trails my WJ can.

The reality is manufacturers have to make money and make vehicles that appeal to *most* people. Generally these days that means IFS/IRS at the cost of more "hardcore" offroad ability. The few folks left that "must" have a solid axle buy Wranglers (or 3/4-1 ton Ford/RAM trucks).


I think my idea of capable is a bit more extreme than even the typical Overlander, and with the Wrangler on the market (and Gladiator) I understand why most manufacturers don't bother trying to hit that mark.

-TJ

I've owned 3 XJ's several years ago. I find it funny that they weren't "real Jeeps" and weren't very popular then, now the times have changed!

When you can build a 40"+ monster with BOLT ON parts, you've definitely got the market cornered!

 

[MidOH]

Depends on the task at hand.

My clique? We travel mostly very mild gravel and dirt roads. Too bad that they can get destroyed by a summertime storm in seconds. Same roads with 30" of snow on them. Soft grass fields. Round stone beach launching jetskies. Sandy beaches. Most of us look like poseurs. Rubicons and Powerwagons being lead down the trail by a piddly lame Quigley 4x4 GMC Express van with pink window curtains. But those overbuilt trucks sure can be handycwhen things go sideways.

Mild Subaru friendly trips can become hardcore rockcrawling as soon as you slide off the road into a ditch, entire state turns into mud, or your fellow overlanders are just plain stupid.

So general ruleof thumb, give or take: 33" tires for jeeps, rangers, taco's. 35" tires for half tons. 35-38" tires for one tons. 37 is perfect, some of us would rather not partake with our fullsize when things get that hardcore. Nothing fancy usually is needed. A decent stock 4x4 with slightly oversized tires.

One locker is a must have for me. Doesn't matter which axle. Two might be overkill, but sure is nice.

MT's only. Cooper stt, Toyo MT, Maxxis Razor are the most popular with consistent good results. New MT's work on the street so so well, that you should never chicken out with AT's.

Basic recovery tools. A highlift to winch with, for example. Fancy winches really aren't a must have.

After all of that, staying way, waaaay under your GVWR. That GVWR is for girly streets, things get worse off road. Going off road, over GVWR, seems to universally suck with any vehicle. Many do it though. (nearly all jeepers do)

Have fun. Find other overlanders and fo. Don't wheel alone ever.

 

[MidOH]

I'll bet the disappointing new vehicle that you mention is the sorry turd of a Defender. What a disgrace.

Get a Bronco, Ranger, Wrangler, Gladiator, Zr2, instead.

 

[Bama_Kiwi]

I'll bet the disappointing new vehicle that you mention is the sorry turd of a Defender. What a disgrace.

Get a Bronco, Ranger, Wrangler, Gladiator, Zr2, instead.

You literally just played straight into OP's hand lol

 

[MidOH]

Sometimes you have to spring the trap.

 

[Dave K]

If it can make it down a dirt road on the way to some ‘gram worthy spot just off the path, photograph well after a filter or two and is easily parked at the mall through rain sleet AND snow it will have 85% of the overland market covered out of the box.

As I see it, most “overlanders” are basically in what I like to refer to as the Corvette Catagory. The have something cool that has capabilities that far and away exceed how they use them. Way more than they need to do what they like to do. The difference is, the Corvette people don’t worry about it. I believe many “overlanders” just like messing with stuff which is fine. So do I.

Doesn’t matter how capable a rig is off the lot if you put an inexperienced driver behind the wheel. The flip of that is an experienced driver can do a whole lot with a vehicle having limited capabilities.

 

[MidOH]

Just give me a nearly stock CC LB truck and a hardside camper, some flat black Oracal to protect the paint, and I'm good to go.

 

[m_lars]

Just give me a nearly stock CC LB truck and a hardside camper, some flat black Oracal to protect the paint, and I'm good to go.

I couldn't drive something that big on the trails I frequent. My little LR3 is nearly unrecognizable from the mountain pin-stripping.

 

[m_lars]

I'll bet the disappointing new vehicle that you mention is the sorry turd of a Defender. What a disgrace.

Get a Bronco, Ranger, Wrangler, Gladiator, Zr2, instead.

I did't say it's disappointing. People dis it hard core when NO ONE knows what it's really capable of. I genuinely think if you put some decent tires on it, it'll keep up with any of those vehicles in stock form. Now obviously if you bolt up some ultimate dana 60s on one of those Jeeps.... I may get egg on my face for that comment, but that remains to be seen.

 

[M Rose]

If the original was so incapable back then, why is it still so coveted. The rig was leaps and bounds above anything else on the market at its time for technology. It bridged a span of a decade without much change other than technology, only to be outdone by the XJ. After the 1st gen, the second gen was a masterpiece not only in design, but functionality as well. If the originals were so bad and incapable, then how did they manage to win so many off-road races spanning 4 decades and 5 generations. The new release has HUGE shoes to fill. I am still on the fence with it because it doesn’t hold true to the roots buried in its past. But with all things, time will tell.

 

[MidOH]

It's all good. All I have left, is wide dirt roads and singletrack.

I expect it to be equal or greater than a 4 door Rubicon. Like the older Defender, I doubt it'll meet that expectation.

It's odd to me how good the original Defender was for everyone, then when we got our hands on one, it really wasn't that good. It's handily outclassed by the Wrangler. And now they put the Defenders namesake on a Honda CRV thing. Lolz, can't even make this stuff up.

Expo East was a fine example of how the easiest overlanding ever, can go sideways and make very seasoned travelers quite incapable. One good rainstorm, and the hardcore poseurs with giant mud terrain tires, ain't so silly anymore.

 

[Smileyshaun]

Anything can be capable , just matters a lot on the loose nut behind the wheel

 

[J.W.]

 

[tjZ06]

I expect it to be equal or greater than a 4 door Rubicon. Like the older Defender, I doubt it'll meet that expectation.

Not to start a war here, but what about an OG Defender is great than a 4 door Rubi? Some of the Defenders are obviously shorter and thus have a tighter turning radius and better break-over angle... but there are 2 door Rubis for that.

-TJ

 

[tjZ06]

One good rainstorm, and the hardcore poseurs with giant mud terrain tires, ain't so silly anymore.

You bring up a VERY good point. Not many folks think about what would happen if a giant storm rolled through the trial they came in on before they leave to go back out...

-TJ