Overlanding with "stock" 4X4

[M Rose]

Hmm I guess my 89 bronco must have come from china then, 20k would really go a long way.... 427 stroker, or why not a cat backed by allison, rockwell axles, 4 link front and rear, coilovers, fiberglass front clip, aluminum rear quarters, I think my budget is spent now. but wait I spent 2k including the purchase and have a very capable rig that holds its own against the 40k Jeeps, and 4k in purchase of my stock 2500 2nd gen ram that again more than holds its own against any jeep stock or not..

Btw I have owned more jeep brand rigs than any other, dumped more money into making capable trail worthy rigs than any other make I have owned, and lastly other than my 2 rams, my second most owned brand has been Ford, and again also the second most money spent to keep on the road after abuse on the trail. My ram lost its power steering pump on one trail ride, I broke a stabalizer shock landing on a tree stump after the power steering pump went out, and I took out the radiator after the upper radiator hose burst while towing my tt a crossed country, and lastly when I hit 300k in the Ram the engine started drinking oil instead of gas and the steering gearbox needa attention... other than that, the Ram has been excellent to me for over 260,000 miles in 6 years.
I am hard on rigs, and if a rig can get me by 2 years without a major brakedown I feel good about the purchase. I have yet to get 2 years on any jeep product made after 1979 wihout some kind of major mechanical malfunction. I have already told you my story on my 06 rubi and how that 4 month ordeal turned out.

 

[grubworm]

This has devolved to a silly bunch of puffery with at least one person not even understanding what is being said,

i agree...its just starting to get good!

 

[Lanlubber In Remembrance]

Oddly enough, I’ve found somewhat opposite. While Jeep has moved like many modern manufacturers through the years to specialized components, those older defenders and the early discos were pretty serious in their design about using off the shelf parts wherever possible. For example when I needed a front wheel bearing for my 2014 Toyota, it was $$$ and had to come from the warehouse at a local parts supplier, the local dealer, or somewhere over the internet. My hubs on the D1, use a standard set 37, front, rear, left, right, inner, outer, ALL hubs use the same bearing. I can rebuild an entire axles’s bearings and seals for less than that single front hub bearing assembly from the newer Toyota. If I’m carrying spares, a single spindle will bolt at any of the four corners, a pair of bearings will service any of the corners, etc. it reduces cost of spares, space they require, and weight.

Lanlubber said:


I wouldn't have known this if not for your info or worse yet having to find out for myself. I've heard enough about how bad Disco's are and how expensive they are to own. It's all a bunch of crap in what seems an effort by Toyota and Jeep people in these forums to downgrade Land Rover's of all makes. As far as dependability Toyota has shown it is a very reliable vehicle but when they break, and they do, they cost more to fix than any vehicle I know of aside from Mercedes.

Keep up the good reports you have posted pertaining to your LRD. Of all the repairs you have done to your Disco, I have seen none that are any different than any other 4x4 type vehicle being used by off roaders and your cost have been very much in line with any other make. Thank you for your first hand knowledgeable information.

 

[Lanlubber In Remembrance]

I’m specifically NOT talking ANY LR vs ANY Jeep. I’m talking about the two in the video YOU quoted. THAT LR and derivatives of IT are designed with parts interchangeability and sourcing that’s not of this decade. It’s built on purpose similar to my ‘74 Bronco’s Dana 44 rather than the jeeps’ Dana 44. Only in the case of the defender they simplified the spindle further rather than using one size bearing onboard and another outboard like the ford, they said no “use the same bearing everywhere” both axles, both sides, inboard, outboard, one bearing PN.

They just dont know where your coming from. Your wasting your time on Biased openions. Make the rigs equal (lockers) and both are fully capable in ANY country or terrane. As for our rigs I'll just add this video.

stock land rover discovery versus non stock jeeps - Search Videos

www.bing.com

 

[grubworm]

 

[Billiebob]

I have yet to get 2 years on any jeep product made after 1979 wihout some kind of major mechanical malfunction

This is a case of maintenance, professional mechanics and paying attention.

I've driven for 50 years, a million plus miles in heavy trucks, I put 24K miles a year on my TJR, a third of that towing a trailer, my YJ I sold with 300K miles on its third engine. I had two breakdowns strand me. The alternator went on my YJ and I failed to look at the voltage gauge. And the tranny went in my 5.9 Grand.... but even that did not strand me, I nursed it 50 miles to a tranny shop.

No if you regularly are getting stranded, needing a tow, you are doing something wrong..... regardless of what you drive. Nothing just catastrophically fails. There are always signs and sounds of impending doom. A good mechanic doing an oil change will check driveline, brakes, steering, lights, battery, charging. But if you do oil changes in the driveway, you likely miss that service and some guys can break anything.

 

[Lanlubber In Remembrance]

This is a case of maintenance, professional mechanics and paying attention.

I've driven for 50 years, a million plus miles in heavy trucks, I put 24K miles a year on my TJR, a third of that towing a trailer, my YJ I sold with 300K miles on its third engine. I had two breakdowns strand me. The alternator went on my YJ and I failed to look at the voltage gauge. And the tranny went in my 5.9 Grand.... but even that did not strand me, I nursed it 50 miles to a tranny shop.

No if you regularly are getting stranded, needing a tow, you are doing something wrong..... regardless of what you drive. Nothing just catastrophically fails. There are always signs and sounds of impending doom. A good mechanic doing an oil change will check driveline, brakes, steering, lights, battery, charging. But if you do oil changes in the driveway, you likely miss that service and some guys can break anything.

If I used up 3 engines in 300,000 miles I would be fit to be tied. I have never owned a modern day vehicle ( 1970 and up) that didn't give me 200,000 honest miles even with city driving. I have a 1967 International 3/4 ton truck that gave me 325,000 miles before it quit (wore the cam bushing clear down to bare metal) I never changed bearings, rings, head gaskets or valve job in all that time. I did a valve job and a rebuilt short block with all new accessories including carb. That was 20 years ago and it has 357,000 on it now and still going. Only repairs needed have been brakes and master cyl. and points. It still has the original distributor. The Chrysler 727 auto tranny with granny gear has never been worked on and dosent even leak today. This truck was used in construction and hauled more rock than I can remember until I replaced the engine and retired it to garbage duty.

 

[M Rose]

This is a case of maintenance, professional mechanics and paying attention.

I've driven for 50 years, a million plus miles in heavy trucks, I put 24K miles a year on my TJR, a third of that towing a trailer, my YJ I sold with 300K miles on its third engine. I had two breakdowns strand me. The alternator went on my YJ and I failed to look at the voltage gauge. And the tranny went in my 5.9 Grand.... but even that did not strand me, I nursed it 50 miles to a tranny shop.

No if you regularly are getting stranded, needing a tow, you are doing something wrong..... regardless of what you drive. Nothing just catastrophically fails. There are always signs and sounds of impending doom. A good mechanic doing an oil change will check driveline, brakes, steering, lights, battery, charging. But if you do oil changes in the driveway, you likely miss that service and some guys can break anything.

I guess a lot of the hard life rigs, well all but my TJR, were hard earned mechanic specials that I purchased with the known intent the rig was on its last legs and needed put down before I even got involved with it. I got most of them fixed up to be road worhy before getting tired of the projects and passing them on. One rig I had high hopes for ended up becoming a parts rig for another rig and was the only rig until the TJR that I ever let go without it being a sound driving rig. The TJR didnt make it 80,000 miles before itmended up in the scrap yard.

Btw I was a professional mechanic for 25 years unil health made me close my doors in 2016. A real professional mechanic doesnt have ime o work on his own rigs, and worse yet have he cash to do things right when the time calls for it so he does what he has to do to get by. My 1990 XJ was a great vehicle, and I dumped a ton of money keeping ha one on he road, and some one got a steal when I let it go for 800 bucks. The rig had close to 400,000 on the body, but mechanically, it had about 50,000 miles, as everyhing from the tires to the roof rack from front bumper to rear bumper was replaced over the 4 years I walked to work while ownig it. But was hat the best stock overlanding rig, by no means.
Dont get me wrong, Jeep vehicles are great, but the Tj and YJ are not.... dont even get me started o. Yuppy jeeps.

 

[Billiebob]

If I used up 3 engines in 300,000 miles I would be fit to be tied.

I average about 200K miles before replacing the engine. Agreed one of those was a rebuilt not remanufactured which died early, I'll never do another rebuild. But I don't wait for the engine to die. I get to the point where it needs something expensive, like an oil pump, and I replace it with a new remanufactured engine with a 7 year warranty. I know there are guys who take pride in getting 500K miles out of an engine. Me, I replace an engine when the cost to keep it running is close to the cost to replace it and I get a tight engine with as new performance and zero needs for another 5 years.

I'm hard on my vehicles. Lots of miles every year and towing a trailer in the mountains for a third of it. And I hate the thought of needing a tow truck. So I spend more on maintenance and mechanics than the average guy.

 

[Downs]

I average about 200K miles before replacing the engine. Agreed one of those was a rebuilt not remanufactured which died early, I'll never do another rebuild. But I don't wait for the engine to die. I get to the point where it needs something expensive, like an oil pump, and I replace it with a new remanufactured engine with a 7 year warranty. I know there are guys who take pride in getting 500K miles out of an engine. Me, I replace an engine when the cost to keep it running is close to the cost to replace it and I get a tight engine with as new performance and zero needs for another 5 years.

I'm hard on my vehicles. Lots of miles every year and towing a trailer in the mountains for a third of it. And I hate the thought of needing a tow truck. So I spend more on maintenance and mechanics than the average guy.

Well that's one way to do it :D I've got a crate motor waiting in the wings to go into my XJ. But I'm waiting on something a little more catastrophic than an oil pump. It already has a little blowby but has solid oil pressure and no funky noises. Waiting for my plug change interval to check the compression again but when I first bought it it was good to go on that front too. Almost 210k miles on it now.

Seriously considering taking that Crate motor down and building a mild stroker while I've got the time to do it.

 

[roots66]

I wheeled a stock 2004 Colorado z71 for a few years, and managed to put it a few places it probably shouldn't have been. That being said, I bought an 03 Nissan Xterra that won't remain stock for very long.

Other than a new leveling kit, my 2012 Colorado is totally stock. So much so, it just recently got it's factory original tires replaced with the identical new ones. I've never had a problem overlanding anywhere I went. Then again, I never went anywhere I thought it could not go. The best modification to any vehicle is using your common sense.

 

[Lanlubber In Remembrance]

Other than a new leveling kit, my 2012 Colorado is totally stock. So much so, it just recently got it's factory original tires replaced with the identical new ones. I've never had a problem overlanding anywhere I went. Then again, I never went anywhere I thought it could not go. The best modification to any vehicle is using your common sense.

As it should be. I cant imagine anyone going into something they are not equipped for more than once in a lifetime. I only made one mistake like that in my life and yes, it was a stupid one. Stupid enough to know you have to use the brains God gave us or you could die.
Even with the best equipment you still have to think and have the driving skills to overcome many different obstacles. I'm not even talking things like rock crawling or any other challenging course, I'm talking ordinary off roading on trails 20 miles from the nearest highway.

 

[reaver]

Other than a new leveling kit, my 2012 Colorado is totally stock. So much so, it just recently got it's factory original tires replaced with the identical new ones. I've never had a problem overlanding anywhere I went. Then again, I never went anywhere I thought it could not go. The best modification to any vehicle is using your common sense.

The only thing I ever did to the colorado was some mud tires, and some super skidz. My main issue with it is the wheelbase (Mines a crew cab), and I keep blowing cv seals on the front diff. Those stupid things are a pain.

189k on the original engine and trans though. It does burn oil due to faulty valve guides. I've got a new head that I need to send out for a valve job, but I'm not in a huge hurry. That'll probably happen in the spring.

 

[Downs]

The only thing I ever did to the colorado was some mud tires, and some super skidz. My main issue with it is the wheelbase (Mines a crew cab), and I keep blowing cv seals on the front diff. Those stupid things are a pain.

189k on the original engine and trans though. It does burn oil due to faulty valve guides. I've got a new head that I need to send out for a valve job, but I'm not in a huge hurry. That'll probably happen in the spring.

I bet you can slap some new valve seals on there and make it stop burning oil by quite a bit. Even with worn valve guides the seals sit ontop like an umbrella so should keep the majority of the oil out of the valve guide.

 

[Graeman]

How about some discussion, or a YouTube, about overlanding in a stock 4X4? Seems most info is about mod rigs as if to say one can't go overlanding to adventure in a stock vehicle. It seems that the manufacturers of 4X4's wouldn't agree given that they have invested no small amount of effort in R&D and they outfit with suspensions, drives, AT tires (etc) and market specifically claiming that capability. What are the realities of overlanding in a stock 4X4? What are the capabilities and restrictions associated with "stock"? Why do you say that larger tires and lifts are "required"? Does adventure require investments into a modified rig? I'm an old sailor and we had the expression that "paradise looks the same regardless of the size of the cockpit".

It really depends on 2 things - the vehicle and the terrain. What if your stock vehicle is a Jeep Rubicon, Ram Power Wagon? Those are highly capable vehicles. What if you drive a Chrysler minivan, Fiat 500? Those are both enjoyable vehicles that are way different. What if your idea of overlanding/camping is going to a resort in Vail, CO? What if you like to go to the Mojave Desert for a week at a time?
See it really is up to you and what you like to do with your time. Having a fully capable off road vehicle makes the trip easier and takes you further than you ever imagined possible. Having a stock vehicle is the canvas to your adventure - paint it how you like and enjoy what you have. Unless your name is Jones and then we all know how that will turn out.

 

[samuraj]

....and now go back to schedule program !
can we overland with stock 4x4 or NOT !
how about this , drive stock vehicle , see places , sleep in comfy hotels and called OVERLANDING ?

 

[Anak]

....and now go back to schedule program !
can we overland with stock 4x4 or NOT !
how about this , drive stock vehicle , see places , sleep in comfy hotels and called OVERLANDING ?

All we need now is for Travelodge to rebrand themselves as "Overlanding".

Everybody deserves a participation trophy.

 

[reaver]

All we need now is for Travelodge to rebrand themselves as "Overlanding".

Everybody deserves a participation trophy.

Or, better yet, "Overlodging". Insert Trademark. No uses without paying royalties. Boom. Profit for me!

I bet you can slap some new valve seals on there and make it stop burning oil by quite a bit. Even with worn valve guides the seals sit ontop like an umbrella so should keep the majority of the oil out of the valve guide.

I actually have a whole new (used) head assembly sitting in a box in my basement. I want to do a full valve job on it, that way I can pull the old head off, and put the new one on in a weekend. Might as well do a timing set while I'm at it too, since I have to open it up to get the head off anyways.

 

[Chevyman29]

Now that your fully outfitted with your 4 star hotel on wheels we need to work on that suspension . After adding you 1500-2000lbs of overlanding “essentials I’m sure that suspension is bouncing off the bump stops hitting a penny on the road .
So on your front suspension you want to make sure to put in so much lift that you have a good inch maybe 1 1/2 inches of down travel left in your suspension and that you keep your CV axles always at an angle, Because you wouldn’t want them lasting a long time you need to prove to everyone you’re a true Overlander when you break them driving over a curb. And also gotta get some heavy duty springs to combat that winch bumper and 30 lights hanging off it . Rear suspension is the same formula super heavy springs and you might as well toss on some remote reservoir shocks on there for all that high speed desert running you won’t be doing . Now the absolute best part of your new suspension set up is that when you don’t have your camping gear..... sorry sorry overlanding gear in it it will ride like an absolute brick you will feel every bump and crack in the road. ITS GONNA BE AWSOME !!!! Oh and I also forgot to mention that your wants almost fuel-efficient 4 x 4 will now I’ll probably be down to almost the single digits from struggling with all your extra gear tireoh and I also forgot to mention that your wants almost fuel-efficient 4 x 4 will now probably be down to almost the single digits from struggling with all your extra gear , armor and tires. Now you could combat that with re-gearing your axles, but maybe you have come to the sensible conclusion that your vehicle is just too small to start off with anybody going to be getting bad gas mileage you might as well have a larger more comfortable vehicle with a bigger motor to start out, and then you know what the best part of doing that is you get a start all over again and start over loading this vehicle to with all of your ”essential” overlanding gear .

So to recap on my ridiculously long rant. Throw some camping gear in your rig have basic recovery gear and start off easy just traveling down gravel roads learning your vehicle and knowing what it can and can’t do. Learn and adjust from your trips what things YOU need for YOUR style of travel . What works for one person out in the desert it’s probably gonna be half worthless for someone that travels in the snow and vice versa.
So in other words run what you Have and enjoy yourself , be smart and Most importantly let two people From different households know where you’re planning on going and when you should return.

All joking aside , your advice about letting 2 people from DIFFERENT house holds know when and where your going and when your coming back is really great advice that I haven't thought about . Ty for sharing .

 

[M Rose]

I always tell at least 2 different people where I am going, when I am leaving, expected return time, secondary return time, local SAR contact information to the destinations and along my rout. I also try to give them gps locations to primary and secondary camp spots, places I think I might have difficulties traveling through, a description of the clothing my family and I will be wearing, and a picture of all of us in front of our rig all loaded up. (This is for my weekend trips) when just a day trip omit camp spots, and insert trail or destination. Alsovery rarely that I travel as a lone wolf. Usually I have one other family going with us.