More than one unrepairable punctured tyre?

[Alanymarce]

Interesting thread. I see I can buy an inner tube to fit my 265/70R16 tires, for $29. Would this be a good backup to carry for "unrepairable" sidewall issue? I figure a puncture in tread can be plugged, and a sidewall can be patched... even if a side patch won't hold pressure, it should be able to hold up with an inner tube temporarily installed?



I have a decent patch kit, but for $29 if a tube gets me an effective "2nd spare", why not carry one?

Good question - I guess the intention of the thread is to judge whether a second spare is necessary. I can see that a tube would proveide a "plan C" in the event of two destroyed tyres with only one spare. The corollary is, of course, the need to have the tools and know-how to install the tube. It's decades since I had to do this, and I'd prefer to avoid having to do so again.

For what it's worth, I'd say that a field repair with a "jerky" kit is a lot easier than installing a tube.

 

[Alanymarce]

I wouldn't carry two if i wasn't pulling the trailer, but I'm also not traveling in the third world in most cases.

- also part of my search for understanding.

On trips in the last decade(ish) we have experienced two punctures in Canada, one in Australia (with one of these three unrepairable) so 3 punctures per 100,000 km (more or less) in what most would consider the "first world" (all with good ATs). In terms of "non-repairable) punctures, 1 per 100,000 km.

In the "third world" we had two in South America (one unrepairable) in the early part of our first "big trip" when we realised that we had failed to choose adequate tyres. Once we had good ATs on we experienced three more and none (!) in Africa (all of these repairable). So 3.3 per 100,000 km. In terms of "non-repairable) punctures, 1 per 100,000 km.

About the same rate for "third" and "first" world trips in terms of statistical significance (+/- 10%), both overall and in terms of punctures which were not field-repairable, ignoring the period during which we had inadequate tyres.

 

[Alanymarce]

Something you already know, but others that may be planning a multi-year or multi-country trip that one day might read this may not, is to replace your tires sooner rather than later. We all like to stretch our money but replacing a set of tires that may have at least 5,000 miles on them is better than kicking yourself about not doing it while dealing with a problem tire on a trail or remote track. While we only had one tire failure over 100,000 miles, on a highway oddly enough, we did have a incident with our fridge that was entirely my fault for not taking the 10 minutes to check the mounting bolts. Fortunately no damage was done but staying on top of that preventative maintenance cannot be stressed enough. In the case of our fridge, I had tightening those bolts on my list for at least a year. I kept putting it off because it was a little inconvenient to do because part of our kitchen would need to be removed (which I intentionally made easy) but I just figured it was so unlikely to ever be a problem I kept putting it off. Murphy came a knocking on a true single track that had Mandi cradling the fridge on the floor while I crawled the van to the first sorta pullout to assess the situation. She was a great sport and didn't hammer me on not tightening those bolts. A couple was driving by and asked if we needed help, we didn't, but a few miles further (after we re-installed our fridge) we stopped to see if they needed help with a flat. They were good but we ended up plugging and airing their tire up in camp (small dead end parking area at a glacial lake in the Andes). He said they were buying new tires as soon as they went back down the mountain. They didn't look bad but he said he experienced a puncture on a different tire the week prior, thinking he may have left his repair kit along the road. We ran into them about a week later and they had 5 new tires and a pieced together repair kit. I would have guesstimated they had about 8k miles easy on their old tires but obviously that wasn't what they actually had based on the road conditions.

Great advice, and thanks for sharing.

 

[Alanymarce]

The only real benefit I would have with a second spare would be saving an hour or so to avoid repairing in the field.

Thank you. Good advice! Yes, as you say, one could save an hour. On the other hand a second spare adds mass, affects CoG (not much, I know), and costs money.

 

[bgenlvtex]

- also part of my search for understanding.

On trips in the last decade(ish) we have experienced two punctures in Canada, one in Australia (with one of these three unrepairable) so 3 punctures per 100,000 km (more or less) in what most would consider the "first world" (all with good ATs). In terms of "non-repairable) punctures, 1 per 100,000 km.

In the "third world" we had two in South America (one unrepairable) in the early part of our first "big trip" when we realised that we had failed to choose adequate tyres. Once we had good ATs on we experienced three more and none (!) in Africa (all of these repairable). So 3.3 per 100,000 km. In terms of "non-repairable) punctures, 1 per 100,000 km.

About the same rate for "third" and "first" world trips in terms of statistical significance (+/- 10%), both overall and in terms of punctures which were not field-repairable, ignoring the period during which we had inadequate tyres.

My reference to third world is specifically with regards to likely availability in the case of of a necessary replacement.

 

[Alanymarce]

My reference to third world is specifically with regards to likely availability in the case of of a necessary replacement.

Good point - in Brazil protection of the local tyre industry means that if you can find ATs they are not cheap (USD 2500 for a set of four, 12 years ago!).

 

[Diamond_king999]

The worst we've experienced was two punctures in 13 km, on an unsurfaced "road" in Bolivia - we repaired the first and 13 km later another was destroyed, so we had to use the spare (all this in 42 deg C!).

Oh, I can imagine how frustrating that must have been! Two punctures in just 13 km in scorching heat? That's tough luck. Good thing you had a spare tire.

 

[Alanymarce]

Oh, I can imagine how frustrating that must have been! Two punctures in just 13 km in scorching heat? That's tough luck. Good thing you had a spare tire.

The only concern was that we now had no spare, and had a couple of hundred km to get to a village, on a road which had already given us two punctures. Hence the decision on the next "big trip" to take two spares; on that trip we had no punctures at all. On the following "big trip" we started with one spare, added a second when we read government advice to take two on the GRR; after that we had no punctures at all... On the last "big trip" we did have two punctures, however both were repairable at the roadside so once again, no spare was needed.

Now, this is all personal experience, and this is only around 250,000 km in the last decade or so (we've covered 192,267 km on "big trips" and don't use the vehicle much in between them). Hence the thread - to gain insight from others so that we have more significance in the statistics.

 

[Diamond_king999]

Well, dang! Sounds like you've been through some rough road trips with those punctures. Government advice can be helpful sometimes, huh? It's always good to be prepared.

 

[Alanymarce]

Well, dang! Sounds like you've been through some rough road trips with those punctures. Government advice can be helpful sometimes, huh? It's always good to be prepared.

Overall it works out at 3 punctures with inadequate tyres in around 10,000 km (one a total loss), and 5 punctures in 240,000 km (one a total loss, one replaced for peace of mind). For comparison, we rented aa 4x4 in Uganda once and the tyres were in terrible shape, I think we had 5 punctures in a week!

re Government advice, I agree that it's good to pay heed, although on the occasion mentioned, we didn;t actually need the second spare.

 

[Alanymarce]

Many thanks to all who have replied - it's helpful to hear your experience.

Summary so far:

- Carry a repair kit and compressor, consider carrying tubes (in which case also tyre levers etc.). Note from experience - carry a lot more "jerky" than you think you need, because you'll end up repairing punctures experienced by others.
- Consider carrying a spare tyre (on its own, not mounted on a rim) as well as the spare on a rim.
- Consider carrying patches/gaiters and associated kit to give capacity to fix damaged sidewalls, to be able to make it to a tyre dealer.
- take care when driving to avoid hitting concealed stumps, rocks, etc. I know, easy to say, and I'm sure that everyone one drives with due care and attention. Perhaps what I'm trying to say is to be aware of the risk and manage it. I remember in Moremi a discussion with a group travelling ahead of us who had experienced a puncture on a stump, which reminded us of the potential, so that we were especially carefully on the track.
- consider installing TPMS, which can detect a loss of pressure before the tyre is so badly damaged that it becomes unrepairable.

The key seems to be that losing two tyres (beyond being field repairable) is very unlikely but can happen. The risk is low, and so it's a matter of personal choice whether to carry a second spare, with additional mass and space required.

The peace of mind which comes from having two spares is worth it for some.