Inverter needs-how much

[Lanlubber In Remembrance]

I am sure you can find a nice diagram on how to set things up but the basics are:
1-2 Batteries
Solar Controller to charge batteries
Solar Panel of your choice (100 watt or better would be my recommendation)
A Fuseblock (Bluesea for example) to connect USB plugs, and anything else 12 volt
Inverter direct to the battery (Should have a fuse)

Bonus items (On off switch to turn everything completely off) OR
Battery switch that allows you to get power from battery 1 or battery 2, or both. (Blue Sea Systems 300 Amp m-Series Battery Switches)
Shore power so you can plug in and charge batteries at home (Noco brand work well)

In the Southwest I think 2 batteries are overkill because solar works so well. I have a 95ah starter/deep cycle battery in my FJ and another 95ah deep cycle in my trailer. My 100 watt panel can keep both happy while camping in a matter of hours. I manually switch my fridge to be powered off of the trailer battery when I am base camping.

Everything you say here confirms what I am learning today.I think you have a thouough knowledge on this subject. I will follow your advise. You covered a few things (bonus items) that were not mentioned in the videos etc. My away from home shore power is a 900 watt gas generator and battery charger if the solar cant keep up. Eventually I want my car charging system to handle the charging system when I am moving. The car already charges the Scamp trailer battery when driving. When parked I will have three batteries, 2 on the solar and possibly tied to the trailer battery as well . There will be times when I will not have the trailer and only have my vehicle due to bad road conditions. It will be disbursed camping and that is when I want solar power the most. Then I will need it for the ref. mostly for long stays off grid. Thanks for the excellent info and advise. Lanlubber

 

[1Louder]

Everything you say here confirms what I am learning today.I think you have a thouough knowledge on this subject. I will follow your advise. You covered a few things (bonus items) that were not mentioned in the videos etc. My away from home shore power is a 900 watt gas generator and battery charger if the solar cant keep up. Eventually I want my car charging system to handle the charging system when I am moving. The car already charges the Scamp trailer battery when driving. When parked I will have three batteries, 2 on the solar and possibly tied to the trailer battery as well . There will be times when I will not have the trailer and only have my vehicle due to bad road conditions. It will be disbursed camping and that is when I want solar power the most. Then I will need it for the ref. mostly for long stays off grid. Thanks for the excellent info and advise. Lanlubber

Pros and cons to every setup. In your case a portable solar suitcase would work well. Then you can use it with our without your trailer. I have the Renogy 100 and have had it for years. I will eventually add a fixed panel to my truck and maybe my main trailer but portable also allows you to keep your vehicle in the shade and solar where the sun is.. :)

 

[Lanlubber In Remembrance]

Exactly! I just have to watch enough YouTube videos to give me the courage to actually install it myself lol.

Same here, The last time I monkeyed with just cleaning the battery on my Land Rover discovery it took me two days to get it running again. God forbid never disconnect the negative first on a LRD2 or connect the negative first when you reconnect.

 

[Lanlubber In Remembrance]

Pros and cons to every setup. In your case a portable solar suitcase would work well. Then you can use it with our without your trailer. I have the Renogy 100 and have had it for years. I will eventually add a fixed panel to my truck and maybe my main trailer but portable also allows you to keep your vehicle in the shade and solar where the sun is.. :)

Right, I would like to be able to use the solar as a booster for the trailer but independently when I don't have the trailer.

 

[RoarinRow]

Same here, The last time I monkeyed with just cleaning the battery on my Land Rover discovery it took me two days to get it running again. God forbid never disconnect the negative first on a LRD2 or connect the negative first when you reconnect.

Yup I hear ya. I am always pleasantly surprised when I don’t get zapped!

 

[Lanlubber In Remembrance]

It seems like most of what you want to use will be 12 volt (including a future fridge). Build yourself a nice DIY charging station that has lots of USB ports. I have a 12 volt charger for traditional rechargeable batteries (flashlights) so I don't have to use 110. I tend to charge my portable HAM radios with the traditional home chargers vs 12 volt.

I don't think you mentioned if this needs to be in your vehicle or a trailer. That also might steer you one direction or another.

Air Pump - If for an air mattress then yes inverter required - If your vehicle has a 110 outlet then you wouldn't need an inverter for that.
Ween the kids off of TV when camping! Then no power required for that. :)
Coffee there are plenty of options that don't require bringing the counter coffee maker (heck there is an entire thread for this!)

I guess what I am getting at is there are a lot of alternatives to power items via 12 volt vs 110 and sometimes you should just leave some stuff at home. But hey that's me. When I had a 2500 watt inverter I did bring a $9 2 slice toaster. That was some serious glamping.

I appreciate your thoughts. You touched on several items that rings some bells in my head. I have a good old fashioned coffee pot (probably 50 years old) and I have a new one I bought 19 years ago in anticipation of Y2K.
I'm camping alone 99% of the time so no children play things are needed. I don't mind admitting That I have no idea what I need electricity for when I travel in my little Scamp trailer. I may need a fantastic fan but I don't have one yet.
I have an a/c unit I built from YouTube ideas but the fan for it is only 12v 80w and I use dry ice that last for a week.
I doubt I will use it very much because I do my camping above 7000 ft. alt. All the elect outlets in the trailer are 110v outlets so normal house hold appliances can be used as long as I have enough battery power. That's where the solar comes in to play. I need the inverter to be able to use the 110v outlets in the trailer.

I will be using as much propane as I can for things like hot water heater, refer., stove, heater, etc.. The Scamp has it's own 12v battery that charges going down the road. It would be nice to be able to keep it charged up with the 100w solar panels since I plan to camp out for as long as a month at a time. I have another rig I use for getting into the real back country where I wont attempt to drag a trailer. That rig has all the necessary kitchen equip. with only the 52 qt. ref. needing electricity. Other items that need electricity are lights, computer, small microwave 750w, and small hand tools. I cant think of anything else I need electricity for but I'm sure as soon as I get out there I will find out fast. I use a tent when I don't have the trailer. Do I know what I'm doing-- No

 

[Flipper]

Understood on the ACR. You are missing my point about the dc/dc charger. I dont know what you are driving but your alternator is not typically capable of charging a second battery to full. That's where the dc/dc charger comes in. It can charge up to 15.3v most alternators will not go that high. It steps up your alternator output to properly and completely charge your secondary AGM battery. This will dramatically increase the life of your secondary battery. It can replace your ACR and solar controller as well.

ce

Understood on the ACR. You are missing my point about the dc/dc charger. I dont know what you are driving but your alternator is not typically capable of charging a second battery to full. That's where the dc/dc charger comes in. It can charge up to 15.3v most alternators will not go that high. It steps up your alternator output to properly and completely charge your secondary AGM battery. This will dramatically increase the life of your secondary battery. It can replace your ACR and solar controller as well.

Yes, I understand how a dc/dc functions. Max charge voltage for AGMs is 14.6-14.8. I installed a Bosch 145A HD alternator when I went over the front of the engine when I replaced everything, water pump, alt,power steering pump, all belts and pullies before a trip to Co. last fall. Didn’t really notice the difference in alternator performance. We have a lot of electrical appliances, between the 20A shore power charger with a Yamaha Inverter/gen. the ACR and solar with the 2 group 31s, we can boondock indefinitely. A DC/DC or a ACR is a good way to bring in a charge. Apples or oranges.

 

[Gray5_Overland]

I'm a bit late to the party, but I recommend Pure Sine Inverters for all but non-sensitive electronics. I keep a 1Kw Pure Sine (PSW) for running the coffee pot, blender, laptop, drone batteries, etc.
I have a 1500W Modified Sine Wave (MSW) Inverter for the things that are less sensitive like my box fan and electric chainsaw (don't laugh, it serves a good purpose!).
If you need more technical help, shoot me a message - I'm pretty adept with inverters.

 

[Lanlubber In Remembrance]

I'm a bit late to the party, but I recommend Pure Sine Inverters for all but non-sensitive electronics. I keep a 1Kw Pure Sine (PSW) for running the coffee pot, blender, laptop, drone batteries, etc.
I have a 1500W Modified Sine Wave (MSW) Inverter for the things that are less sensitive like my box fan and electric chainsaw (don't laugh, it serves a good purpose!).
If you need more technical help, shoot me a message - I'm pretty adept with inverters.

Question, would you think that a small camper trailer that has a battery, 3 way ref. 110v outlets, 12v lighting, would have an inverter some where on board ?

 

[old_man]

For a laptop, you can get a 12v adapter cord with electronics for most laptops for a few bucks on ebay. That way you can charge from in a vehicle as well as the trailer.

I also have 12v USB adapters in my trailer so I don't have to run the inverter.

 

[Lanlubber In Remembrance]

For a laptop, you can get a 12v adapter cord with electronics for most laptops for a few bucks on ebay. That way you can charge from in a vehicle as well as the trailer.
I also have 12v USB adapters in my trailer so I don't have to run the inverter.

I think that kinda answered my question old-man (kinda hard for me to call you that since I have a bunch of years on you). I'm sure my car charges the battery on my trailer. I've never used the trailer in a disbursed situation before and never gave it a thought. I never depended on the battery on board the trailer for anything except the lites in the trailer when the car was shut down. Now that I have solar I'm wondering if my solar system inverter needs to tie into the existing trailer system. I know it needs too. After a thorough inspection I find only a circuit breaker box in the trailer. I am assuming the 110v outlets are for when I have grid service. Can I use the 12v adapter in the 110v outlet and get power from my battery or do I have to get all my electricity from the inverter after it is connected to the battery ? I thought I had this all figured out until this thread brought up some questions. Would my power from the inverter need to be connected to the circuit breaker box ? I'm thinking I have two different electrical systems in the trailer. One for the grid system and one for my onboard battery that I will tie into the solar arrangement. How can I tie the two together, and if I do what happens to the original grid system that is designed to run my refer and outlets. Am I getting into a hornets nest ? My ultimate goal is to have everything in the trailer run off the 12v system but be able to use grid service when I am home. Does any of this make sense to anyone ?
Lanlubber

 

[old_man]

I think that kinda answered my question old-man (kinda hard for me to call you that since I have a bunch of years on you). I'm sure my car charges the battery on my trailer. I've never used the trailer in a disbursed situation before and never gave it a thought. I never depended on the battery on board the trailer for anything except the lites in the trailer when the car was shut down. Now that I have solar I'm wondering if my solar system inverter needs to tie into the existing trailer system. I know it needs too. After a thorough inspection I find only a circuit breaker box in the trailer. I am assuming the 110v outlets are for when I have grid service. Can I use the 12v adapter in the 110v outlet and get power from my battery or do I have to get all my electricity from the inverter after it is connected to the battery ? I thought I had this all figured out until this thread brought up some questions. Would my power from the inverter need to be connected to the circuit breaker box ? I'm thinking I have two different electrical systems in the trailer. One for the grid system and one for my onboard battery that I will tie into the solar arrangement. How can I tie the two together, and if I do what happens to the original grid system that is designed to run my refer and outlets. Am I getting into a hornets nest ? My ultimate goal is to have everything in the trailer run off the 12v system but be able to use grid service when I am home. Does any of this make sense to anyone ?
Lanlubber

I actually have a shore/inverter switch. In one position the 120v outlets are hooked to shore power, in the other the outlets are hooked to the inverter. All you need is a DPDT (Double Pole Double Throw switch). I actually have mine where it has a center position off so I can disconnect both.

 

[Lanlubber In Remembrance]

I actually have a shore/inverter switch. In one position the 120v outlets are hooked to shore power, in the other the outlets are hooked to the inverter. All you need is a DPDT (Double Pole Double Throw switch). I actually have mine where it has a center position off so I can disconnect both.

Thank you Sir, that sounds simple enough for an armature like me to handle. Would you mount that switch on the interior, say maybe close to the circuit breaker box under my sink, or should it be an exterior switch ? My batteries are presently mounted on the back bumper of my trailer. They are exposed to the weather currently and I think they should be in some sort of a box enclosure that I will add. Should the inverter be located on the interior, possibly close to the circuit breaker box or closer to the batteries (I have a location in mind on the back interior wall of the trailer)? I'd prefer the batteries to be on the exterior as they are now for easy access to the solar connections and ease of maintenance. Does that sound reasonable to you ? BTW there is only one battery currently mounted on the rear bumper and I plan to add the second one next to it when I alter the mounting bracket and put them both in a lockable enclosure to avoid theft.. I hope you don't mind working with me on this, you are the only one with any input so far and I think you know I trust your opinion completely.
Lanlubber

 

[old_man]

Thank you Sir, that sounds simple enough for an armature like me to handle. Would you mount that switch on the interior, say maybe close to the circuit breaker box under my sink, or should it be an exterior switch ? My batteries are presently mounted on the back bumper of my trailer. They are exposed to the weather currently and I think they should be in some sort of a box enclosure that I will add. Should the inverter be located on the interior, possibly close to the circuit breaker box or closer to the batteries (I have a location in mind on the back interior wall of the trailer)? I'd prefer the batteries to be on the exterior as they are now for easy access to the solar connections and ease of maintenance. Does that sound reasonable to you ? BTW there is only one battery currently mounted on the rear bumper and I plan to add the second one next to it when I alter the mounting bracket and put them both in a lockable enclosure to avoid theft.. I hope you don't mind working with me on this, you are the only one with any input so far and I think you know I trust your opinion completely.
Lanlubber

I would mount all electronics including the switch internal out of the elements. Make sure and wire with big enough wire from the battery to the inverter. The easiest source might be to cut up a pair of jumper cables.

 

[Lanlubber In Remembrance]

I would mount all electronics including the switch internal out of the elements. Make sure and wire with big enough wire from the battery to the inverter. The easiest source might be to cut up a pair of jumper cables.

Thanks, I was thinking I might mount it all (switch, inverter, battery monitor etc.) on a 3/4" piece of plywd on the back wall of the trailer or in the closet area. I think I read on another post where you suggested the battery cables ($30 on sale @ Harbor freight) but since I only need about 7' of neg and 7' of positive, I think ACE hardware can supply that for a little less. I did buy my 2 battery to battery 12" long #2 cables from Amazon and paid through the nose a big $20 = $10 a foot :-( I'm looking forward for any additional thoughts you might have on my set up that we might not have covered.
Down the road I may be able to help someone else because of your help, Thank you old_man , from an even older old man ! Lanlubber Jim

 

[old_man]

Too bad I'm not home or I could drop you the cable in the mail from my spares/junk box.

Check if you have a local welding/gas supplier. They sell short cut off chunks for pretty much the cost of the copper.

 

[Lanlubber In Remembrance]

Too bad I'm not home or I could drop you the cable in the mail from my spares/junk box.
Check if you have a local welding/gas supplier. They sell short cut off chunks for pretty much the cost of the copper.

Folks, this is where experience is so valuable. I would never have though about a welding supply outlet even though I go there all the time for welding rod, flux wire and bottled gas. " old_man" always has his hat on his head thinking about this stuff. He lives and breathes this stuff and it shows in the quality of his rig. These little things really do add up when your building your rig. I don't know you OB'ers situation, but I have a dump station a mile down the road from my house. They have bens for recyclables, tires, batteries, oil, chemicals, scrap iron and the like. I never go to the dump without savaging something from the ben's. I pulled out a perfectly good spare tire that looked new, it was. I find small pieces of angle iron, bed rails, sheet metal, even metal filing cabinets that I now use to store my power tools. Now I will look for copper cable as well, I know I have seen some in the past, I just didn't need any until now.

People are wasteful and throw away just about everything, even good things when they are cleaning house or moving. I even picked up a microwave that was missing the dish and roller wheel. I went to Habitat for American Restore shop and picked up the needed wheel and dish there. That was three years ago and the thing is still working fine. I also picked up an exercise bike for my wife who later gave it to the house keeper. Imagine the number of motors in washing machines, dryers and all sorts and sizes for a/c units. That's my hardware store of sorts.

 

[Richl]

If you intend to use power tools for commercial use, or any load of 200W for more than 1 hour regularly (between battery recharging) you should install an auxiliary battery to provide power to the inverter. This battery should be a deep cycle type and sized to meet your run time expectations with the engine off. Deep cycle batteries most commonly available are 27 (90 Ah), 4D (150 Ah), 8D (220 Ah) capacity. The auxiliary battery should be connected to the alternator through an isolator module to prevent the inverter from discharging the engine start battery when the engine is off. Read more