What's the deal with repair parts these days???

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freak4life

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well...over 2 weeks and it looks like the used part has arrived from somewhere and now i can drop off the jeep and see how long and how much it will take to install and reprogram the controller. i spoke to the shop earlier and i heard a guy in the background say something about "lube"...not sure if that is for me or the jeep...:neutral:

the dealership cant get the part and wont mess with a used part, so i am reduced to going to shop that is part salvage yard, part tow truck company, part tire repair and part auto mechanic. not getting a good feeling...but apparently the shop is putting two of their best guys on it so maybe i'm just being a bit of a worry wart...

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Please good sir, tell me that is not a selfie.

:)
 

jeepers29

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I love our “capitalistic system” in our economy. Your term “stealership” is a pejorative and unnecessary. They are not in business to not make money. They are not in business to provide you with the least expensive products possible. Free markets work, maybe you should take the risk of losing your capital and open up a dealership and then try selling your products at or below cost so random strangers will feel better about your work and not really care about the risk you took. Just my .02 cents for what it is worth, probably not even .02 anymore.
Blessings
They got the name stealership because in general, they charge rediculous prices for sub par quality work. Most have earned the name.
 

freak4life

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They got the name stealership because in general, they charge rediculous prices for sub par quality work. Most have earned the name.
I understand, but in a free market economy we can choose to buy there or not buy there. Name calling is not needed. I am guilty of name calling and I’m working to stop doing that. Sometimes not very well.
:)
 
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smritte

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hey got the name stealership because in general, they charge rediculous prices for sub par quality work. Most have earned the name.
Actually, your wrong.

The term came about from insecure keyboard and back yard mechanics on forums. There's two diffrent kinds of techs, good and bad. The industry as a whole puts people into a shop without vetting them. This includes dealers. Regardless of where you spend your money, you expect the person working on your vehicle to be an expert. This for the most part is not the case.

People will go to a chain independents (Pep Boy's, Goodyear, Firestone...) and be happy because they spend less dollar per hour to have someone literally guess and throw several parts at a problem. If it is still broken, the customer will be lied to, be made to spend more money and walk away happy they didnt go to the "Stealership".
Have I actually seen this? Yes. many times. Have I seen unscrupulous dealers, yes. Fortunately their being held to the gun where the others, not so much.

I can list countless cases of this. If you want the actual truth, talk to a BAR rep. Three of my close friends work for the BAR in two diffrent counties. The thievery from the non dealers will astound you.

Lets compare.
1. If a dealer has an issue, where do they send the car?
2. If a non dealer has an issue, the car goes to the dealer. But if it goes to the dealer they lose a customer and the sales.
3. Vehicles built from the mid 90's and later are incredibly complicated. The average "I'm good with my hands" person can only guess.
4. Where do non dealer tech's get trained on these systems?
5. Where do non dealer tech's get access to proprietary software and diagnosis a well as specialty tools needed to properly work on modern cars?
6. Most chain independents put a minimum part quota on their techs. You dont upsell enough parts, you can lose you job.
7. many times over the years I've had guys tell me the chain independents shop would compete to see who could sell the most unneeded parts.

On the other hand, just because you work at a dealer dosn't mean you should.
I've worked with or known over a hundred techs. I could show you master techs who should not be allowed to own tools. In my opinion, every single person who touch's a car should at least go to a trade school first. Unfortunately only 1/100 might. Even if they go, they may not have the aptitude for it.

How do I know this? I went to school for automotive, worked in two diffrent dealers on 5 diffrent car lines. After almost 30 years, finished my degree and started teaching automotive tech. I have not only trained over 1000 students but have trained instructors for 4 manufactures and am currently a trainer for a major manufacture. I also do consulting work for a few people.
So Yes, I actually do know what I'm saying

I can tell you this, just because someone works on cars does not qualify them as a tech. It dosent matter where they work. The odds of someone getting a poor tech at a dealer is way less then a non dealer.
When it comes to competency, I see about 1 in 10 students will be good. With the new generation that ratio is getting lower. Then again, I hold people to a very high standard.

When it comes to a shop vetting and training their guys, its literally Euro and most Japanese manufactures hold their people to a very high standard. American manufactures for the most part do not.
I purposely did not include non independent shops. These mostly are good. The only down side is their access to the tools and diagnosis equipment for newer cars.

My advice about this whole mess is in this hobby you need to learn the basics. That way you can hopefully tell if the shop is taking advantage.

Sorry for the thread derail. This is an issue I am not only passionate about but have been spending years trying to help cure.
 

freak4life

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Actually, your wrong.

The term came about from insecure keyboard and back yard mechanics on forums. There's two diffrent kinds of techs, good and bad. The industry as a whole puts people into a shop without vetting them. This includes dealers. Regardless of where you spend your money, you expect the person working on your vehicle to be an expert. This for the most part is not the case.

People will go to a chain independents (Pep Boy's, Goodyear, Firestone...) and be happy because they spend less dollar per hour to have someone literally guess and throw several parts at a problem. If it is still broken, the customer will be lied to, be made to spend more money and walk away happy they didnt go to the "Stealership".
Have I actually seen this? Yes. many times. Have I seen unscrupulous dealers, yes. Fortunately their being held to the gun where the others, not so much.

I can list countless cases of this. If you want the actual truth, talk to a BAR rep. Three of my close friends work for the BAR in two diffrent counties. The thievery from the non dealers will astound you.

Lets compare.
1. If a dealer has an issue, where do they send the car?
2. If a non dealer has an issue, the car goes to the dealer. But if it goes to the dealer they lose a customer and the sales.
3. Vehicles built from the mid 90's and later are incredibly complicated. The average "I'm good with my hands" person can only guess.
4. Where do non dealer tech's get trained on these systems?
5. Where do non dealer tech's get access to proprietary software and diagnosis a well as specialty tools needed to properly work on modern cars?
6. Most chain independents put a minimum part quota on their techs. You dont upsell enough parts, you can lose you job.
7. many times over the years I've had guys tell me the chain independents shop would compete to see who could sell the most unneeded parts.

On the other hand, just because you work at a dealer dosn't mean you should.
I've worked with or known over a hundred techs. I could show you master techs who should not be allowed to own tools. In my opinion, every single person who touch's a car should at least go to a trade school first. Unfortunately only 1/100 might. Even if they go, they may not have the aptitude for it.

How do I know this? I went to school for automotive, worked in two diffrent dealers on 5 diffrent car lines. After almost 30 years, finished my degree and started teaching automotive tech. I have not only trained over 1000 students but have trained instructors for 4 manufactures and am currently a trainer for a major manufacture. I also do consulting work for a few people.
So Yes, I actually do know what I'm saying

I can tell you this, just because someone works on cars does not qualify them as a tech. It dosent matter where they work. The odds of someone getting a poor tech at a dealer is way less then a non dealer.
When it comes to competency, I see about 1 in 10 students will be good. With the new generation that ratio is getting lower. Then again, I hold people to a very high standard.

When it comes to a shop vetting and training their guys, its literally Euro and most Japanese manufactures hold their people to a very high standard. American manufactures for the most part do not.
I purposely did not include non independent shops. These mostly are good. The only down side is their access to the tools and diagnosis equipment for newer cars.

My advice about this whole mess is in this hobby you need to learn the basics. That way you can hopefully tell if the shop is taking advantage.

Sorry for the thread derail. This is an issue I am not only passionate about but have been spending years trying to help cure.
Thanks for the input, I know personally only one true master mechanic. He was fortunate enough to go through 4 years of schooling paid for by BMW. He is my younger sons good friend, I have known him since he was 5 years old. I trust my indie mechanic in Phoenix and he is very competent. Trust is earned as is respect. I’m looking for a trustworthy mechanic here in Colorado.
Blessings Scott
 

parulfojii

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From what I am hearing the Union strikes are making it hard for the dealers and suppliers to get parts. It is putting the mechanic shops I. A bad place. Ironic that the people who make a living fixing thier products can't.
 

Anak

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Not really. They aren't interested in maintaining what they have already sold. Their goal is to sell another car. And they view the mechanics' shops as the enemy. Just look into the "right to repair" battle. That one has been going on for decades. The name "stealership" has been earned.
 

grubworm

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as with everything in life, this subject is just as subjective as anything else and everyone has their own truth and experience. as far as a dealership/stealership goes...everyone is right. my personal experience is that the toyota dealership that i bought my tundra from has been great...providing good service at what i feel is a fair price. and my opinion of a "fair price" is just as subjective...however, i did mention earlier a dodge dealership i used years back when i bought my ram 2500 and went to the dealership (stealership) to get a Mopar oil filter for my cummings engine. think about that...i'm getting a "Mopar" filter for a cummings engine because i was told by the service department it will void the warranty if i dont. i buy the filter for $40 and get home and take it out of the Mopar box and it is a fleetgard filter that another company a few miles away is selling for $15. i live in an oilfield area and there are a lot of businesses that sell filters and stuff for oilfield and marine use. if that company is able to operate by selling filters for $15, why does a dealership need to get a fleetgard filter and put it in a Mopar box and sell it for $40? so the question is this: am i virtuous hero for going to the dodge dealership and paying $40 for a filter that is sold for $15 down the road, or am i a fool for wasting money?

of course there is a LOT more to operating a dealership than marking up a filter and putting them in boxes they dont belong in, but that was my experience with that dealership at the time and after getting some bad service from them and getting fleeced for work on my injector system...i dont put them in a favorable light. im sure they have great mechanics working in the bays that are family men and putting their kids thru college, etc and that i could be considered an ass for speaking bad about a business in a free enterprise system and all that...but then that puts me in the same boat as folk on here who have only the experience of someone posting a comment and judging them on that. out of all that the dodge dealership has done over the years, i only got to experience that one thing with them and i made an opinion based on that. so when folk on here see only the one post or two from a person and make a judgement off that, looks like we end up kind of being all the same...

anyway, back to my abs controller adventure....
got another call that a SECCOND used abs controller has been found and shipped to the shop and in a few hours i will be going in for round 2 of trying to get the jeep back on the road.

and as far as ANY of this goes...i have yet another personal experience that i draw from. i spent a good amount of time working overseas and i have been in some very poor and desolate areas where families were living in huts with no power or water and the kids where playing in dirty ditches full of mosquitoes. i feel VERY blessed to live the way i do and just having a vehicle is a huge blessing we all just take for granted...so while i am complaining about parts and what-not, i am also aware that i have it pretty damn good compared to a lot of other folk in the world and that is why i dont get too worked up over anything...
 
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grubworm

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YEE-HAW! the 2nd try at getting a used abs controller to work has succeeded and the wife is officially back out on the streets in her wrangler...guess that can be taken as a celebration AND a warning to others...:openmouth:

thanks @Garyindiane for the link to module masters...i kept the old controller and will definitely have it rebuilt by these guys in case i need it later
 

jeepers29

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YEE-HAW! the 2nd try at getting a used abs controller to work has succeeded and the wife is officially back out on the streets in her wrangler...guess that can be taken as a celebration AND a warning to others...:openmouth:

thanks @Garyindiane for the link to module masters...i kept the old controller and will definitely have it rebuilt by these guys in case i need it later
Glad to hear you are back on the road. How much did the rebuild cost?
 
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grubworm

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Glad to hear you are back on the road. How much did the rebuild cost?
didnt get the rebuild done yet...just got back from the shop swapping with the used one. i paid right at $600 for the used abs controller and $250 to install it and program it and module master's website said $250 to rebuild one, so hopefully that is still good and i'll get it shipped out asap. not sure how long the used one is going to last, so figure i better have a spare ready

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grubworm

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a few days ago, i saw a black jeep parked on the road at the end of my driveway. it was there the better part of the day and then when i went to check mail, there was a guy there trying to get it started. it was a guy from down the road and his wife was driving the 2013 wrangler sahara when it died on the road. he said he couldnt get parts for it either, and has been limping it along until it just quit.

step-daughter had a 2015 wrangler that kept giving her problems and hard to find parts...yada...yada...yada...and she traded it in on a subaru. i think mama needs to do the same

the wife is an artist...so i propose she make a sculpture out of her wrangler...:grinning:

jeep.jpg
 
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a couple months ago, we went up to wyoming and south dakota with brother-in-law and his wife. we were just outside of gillette, wy when their transmission light came on and the truck shut down. it was a fairly new chevy silverado still under warranty, so no worries...gillette was just a few miles back and they had a chevy dealership. well...it was some kind of valve in the transmission that failed and even though it was covered by warranty...the part was not available. i even went online and called dealerships in louisiana and texas thinking i could get one overnighted. NOPE. it took a week and finally sourced one and had it shipped to the dealership. a month later, they had another warranty issue and again, the part was not available. they traded the truck in on a new one.

now, a week ago, the wife was driving her jeep sahara when the abs and brake light came on. its a 2013 with 100K miles, so it is in really great shape and is basically her grocery getter and light errands vehicle. i plugged in the obd reader and found that it was the abs controller. no problem, i called the dealership to see if they had any in stock. not only do they not have any..NOBODY has them. i called dealerships all over the county including mopar warehouses and every other parts distributor i could find on line. after a little searching, i found out that it has been discontinued by jeep. they were around $350 new and the very best i can hope for is to have the local salvage yard try to source a used one (which is $800 used plus the cost to reprogram it)
jeep is messed up...the abs controller i need is only available on 2012, 2013, & 2014 models. after that, they have a new style and the new jeeps are even different from all those.

looks like older jeep parts are discontinued. i looked at other parts and its the same story. i know there are a lot of older jeeps out there and i wonder how people are going to keep them running if the very manufacturer who made it quit making parts for it? and apparently chevy is no better. i have a tundra, so now i wonder if toyota is also falling into this as well.

anybody else have trouble getting parts?
I worry about that too, I drive the diesel wrangler and it's been discontinued. I plan to keep it as long as I can, but hope they can still do repairs on it done the line. They still make the engine for trucks I believe.
 
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Vanhalo

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I saw this coming during COVID. In late 2021 I started prepping OEM parts for my 2016 JKU. It has been kind of an investment hobby to buy them when I don’t need them anytime I find a deal. Example… that elusive OEM thermostat i bought in 2021 when it was $30. Now it’s $70 on EBay.

anyone who owns a JK 3.6 should have a OEM thermostat and Dorman or OEM oil cooler housing on their shelf before they need it.
 

Vanhalo

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Let's see here. I had a JK. And to be fair, it did not have any specific failures at the time of sale. I do not think that prepping to replace lifters and rockers at 60k is typical, however, given my experiences with the GC, and a fair amount of other research, I chose that option prior to the most likely inevitable failure of those components in the JK which would damage camshafts, etc. That happened in the GC, and to others with Jeeps that I personally know, and to others on a Jeep specific forum I was on. All of the above experience lead me to the conclusion that the lifter/rocker replacement was what I would consider preventative maintenance. Better?

I didn't mention the fragile oil cooler/oil filter housing. I didn't mention the evap system and it's mystery codes, and I didn't specifically mention the buying/hunting of parts that were scarce/unavailable in order to warehouse them in my garage so that when I needed them, I had them vs. what @grubworm had to deal with. So, I appreciate your clarification of my post.

I chose to leave the brand due to real and potential parts failures and parts unavailability which is not unlike where @grubworm is thinking/headed.
I have a complete set of OEM rockers, lifters, cams,oil filter housing, and the left cylinder head for my 2016 Jeep Wrangler. it’s a risk free investment.

additionally all fluid changes for 2 years.
 
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North American Sojourner

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Not really. They aren't interested in maintaining what they have already sold. Their goal is to sell another car. And they view the mechanics' shops as the enemy. Just look into the "right to repair" battle. That one has been going on for decades. The name "stealership" has been earned.
Exactly. Decades ago the Dealerships threw "customer loyalty" in the trash and concentrated on "UNITS out the door"
Automotive "Groups" mainly.
I"m ASE A4/P2/C1 and have worked for KIA, FORD and many brick and mortars for parts, tires and even Shelby.
Dealers mostly only allow an hour "Diag" time for CEL's. Most techs can diag a car or truck in a hour but there are times that deeper problems require consultation with the manufacture, or other dealerships. So yes we've sent cars to other dealerships for help.
I was a service writer for Firestone and never sent a car or truck anywhere except the street. The schools and training at Firestone are amazing. I've been to two.
Todays scanners combined with ALLdata and or Mitchell are very good and most shops have high end electronic support.
Todays engines still require fuel, Air and spark. It's not that hard to figure out.
What we need to do is get our kids into Vocational Technical Schools and stop blaming the uneducated. Blame the parents who've lost control of their kids and harboring their social media aspirations. LOL
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