US National Parks Getting Too Crowded...Reservations?

[AdvNerd]

Hey everyone. I came across this article and wanted to put it up here and get everyone's take on it.

https://www.nytimes.com/2017/09/27/us/national-parks-overcrowding.html

It looks like the attendance at the national parks in the US is continuing to increase. According to the article, in 2016 there were 330 Million visitors to US Parks, that's more people than actually live in the US. In August 2016 alone there were 40 million visitors to US National Parks.

Simply put, the parks are having a hard time keeping up with increased attendance. There are funding issues and conservation issues. These places that were once in the wilderness are being overrun by buses of tourists and people looking to experience the outdoors. The article goes into it a bit more.

On one hand, I'm glad to see so many people taking an interest in the parks. There's a huge movement to get out and experience life that even OB is a part of. I love to see the look on someones face when they see an actual real wild animal for the first time or get to experience the Milky Way without light pollution.

At the same time, I hate that it's nearly impossible to find a place that doesn't have trash of some sort. It's hard to appreciate nature when there is a 50 person line with kids running around just to get a look at a waterfall.

The National Parks Service is trying to find a way to ensure the Parks are there for future generations. I understand why they would want to limit visitorship if the land and wildlife are having a hard time with the increased number of visitors. I think a reservation system (maybe just during peak months?) would be a way to accomplish that.

I would really like to see the parks expand and create some new areas for visitors. I know it's a delicate thing but I feel like they could pull tourists away from the major attraction sites and into other areas, it would lower the impact overall. Maybe also create a marketing program to bring attention to other sites away from the major tourist draws and then build infrastructure to support people at those alternate sites. I'm just brainstorming here.

That's just a bit of my thoughts, I'm curious what you all think. Is a reservation system for visiting the National Parks a good thing? Do you have any alternatives?

 

[shoredreamer]

Supply and demand. They should charge more for entry.

 

[Remington_PRO4X]

Hey everyone. I came across this article and wanted to put it up here and get everyone's take on it.

https://www.nytimes.com/2017/09/27/us/national-parks-overcrowding.html

It looks like the attendance at the national parks in the US is continuing to increase. According to the article, in 2016 there were 330 Million visitors to US Parks, that's more people than actually live in the US. In August 2016 alone there were 40 million visitors to US National Parks.

Simply put, the parks are having a hard time keeping up with increased attendance. There are funding issues and conservation issues. These places that were once in the wilderness are being overrun by buses of tourists and people looking to experience the outdoors. The article goes into it a bit more.

On one hand, I'm glad to see so many people taking an interest in the parks. There's a huge movement to get out and experience life that even OB is a part of. I love to see the look on someones face when they see an actual real wild animal for the first time or get to experience the Milky Way without light pollution.

At the same time, I hate that it's nearly impossible to find a place that doesn't have trash of some sort. It's hard to appreciate nature when there is a 50 person line with kids running around just to get a look at a waterfall.

The National Parks Service is trying to find a way to ensure the Parks are there for future generations. I understand why they would want to limit visitorship if the land and wildlife are having a hard time with the increased number of visitors. I think a reservation system (maybe just during peak months?) would be a way to accomplish that.

I would really like to see the parks expand and create some new areas for visitors. I know it's a delicate thing but I feel like they could pull tourists away from the major attraction sites and into other areas, it would lower the impact overall. Maybe also create a marketing program to bring attention to other sites away from the major tourist draws and then build infrastructure to support people at those alternate sites. I'm just brainstorming here.

That's just a bit of my thoughts, I'm curious what you all think. Is a reservation system for visiting the National Parks a good thing? Do you have any alternatives?

I agree with ShoreDreamer. Here in Wisconsin we don't have any national parks, but has a ton of beautiful state parks. In January you can begin making reservations for camp sites. If you don't make several reservations for the year you won't get a site. Here the parks funding are constantly getting cut due to the current regime in charge and some of the facilities are falling into disrepair. I personally would be more than happy to pay a little extra for entry for park upkeep. This could also have the added benefit of lowering the amount of people in the parks.

Side note- I just returned from South Africa and visited several of their natural parks/landmarks. They were breathtaking. While there I noticed that there was very little if any rubbish on the grounds. While visiting many of the more popular national parks there is always litter. I'm not sure who these people are who are willing to throw their garbage on the ground, but it is saddening. I also visited the Grand Canyon within the last couple years and was totally taken aback by all of the garbage on the ground. Maybe an increase in fees could reduce some of the degradation of our national/state treasures.

 

[MBroenkow]

And this is why I've given up on a lot of National Parks, they're just a victim of their own success. There are so many other wonderful places to go that aren't overpopulated by tourists. I'll probably never go back to parks like Yosemite. Sure they are beautiful but the crowds defeat the purpose of being there.

 

[Remington_PRO4X]

And this is why I've given up on a lot of National Parks, they're just a victim of their own success. There are so many other wonderful places to go that aren't overpopulated by tourists. I'll probably never go back to parks like Yosemite. Sure they are beautiful but the crowds defeat the purpose of being there.

Yosemite could be so beautiful, but I agree the crowds are awful! Maybe they should reduce the buses and other forms of easy transport around the park.

 

[rzims]

All of the above....I think limiting the number of visitors by using reservations is a good idea.(maybe during peak times is a good compromise) I also agree that raising the cost is another way to lower attendance and raise revenue. The funding problem is both the cuts that are being made and the fact that the parks dept, like most bureauracies is so top heavy with managers that there's no budget left for anyone to actually do the work. (but that's a whole different problem)
Last year we went to Grand Teton and Yellowstone and although every "major" attraction was packed with buses and people, we were still able to find solitude by seeking out less popular areas and actually hiking more than 100 yards from the parking lots.
I love Yosemite and it's close to home, but I never go there except in the winter anymore....there's just too many people. And even in winter, you have to leave the valley...

 

[PNWExplore]

I honestly try to stay as far away as possible from Fee areas and certain Day use areas, simply because they are overrun. There is so much in Oregon that it is very easy to escape the crowds and be in complete solitude.

 

[John D.]

I'd rather go off grid completely away from people. A day trip or drive through the parks isn't bad but camping is too hard these days.

 

[buckwilk]

Increasing fees in the parks won't accomplish anything other than to change the demographic. Low income families will be denied and tour bus companies will just increase their fee. N.P. increase travel to the states they are in, perhaps some sort of room, food and rec fee could be levied to help support the parks. How about you volunteer at a park and earn points towards entrance at another park ? Points could be assignable and donated. I would gladly support that kind of program. I volunteer and bank points for folks more disadvantaged than I.

 

[Kcrkolby]

Increasing fees in the parks won't accomplish anything other than to change the demographic. Low income families will be denied and tour bus companies will just increase their fee. N.P. increase travel to the states they are in, perhaps some sort of room, food and rec fee could be levied to help support the parks. How about you volunteer at a park and earn points towards entrance at another park ? Points could be assignable and donated. I would gladly support that kind of program. I volunteer and bank points for folks more disadvantaged than I.

great idea!

 

[druff6991]

Felt this way when I was driving through cibola and gila. Out in the middle if no where, where it's so desolate, nasa put the VLA there. And in the middle, there was a 4 way stop with park rangers conducting traffic [emoji58] I have no fix in mind, just wanted to gripe

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[LostInSocal]

It is a shame. Many of the places I've visited when I was in my teens and early twenties are now overrun. We stay away from the National Parks also. Honestly, I'm more concerned about the conservation aspects of the National Parks rather than making sure the hordes and hordes of people have access to them. I don't have an answer unfortunately.

 

[Jeff Graham]

When visiting big name national parks last month, I ran in to few Americans, but many Germans. I think parks like Yellowstone, Yosemite, etc... have a global appeal. This may also be contributing to the increase visitation. On the flip side: Some of the less well known parks such as Big Bend NP in TX, are much easier to get reservations. In all the national parks I have visited: You can always get away from the crowds, by getting a back country permit, and boondocking (at least this has been my experience)

 

[Remington_PRO4X]

https://www.yahoo.com/news/us-considers-higher-entry-fees-17-popular-national-214119483.html

 

[Jeff Graham]

https://www.yahoo.com/news/us-considers-higher-entry-fees-17-popular-national-214119483.html

I understand the deleme the national park service is in. Each sitting president can declare a site a national monument, most presidents do several of these during their term. This moves the resource from its current holder, to the National Park service.

The problem with this, is that this executive order, doesn't move funding to the park service, just the asset. The park service needs to support an ever increasing number of assets, with a fixed budget.

They use the revenue from the larger parks, to fund all the lesser known national monuments. For many years they have been able to increase revenue, by privatizing park resources. Eventually you run out of resources to privatize. They then started to move funds from capital improvement budget, to support the newly minted national monuments.

The park service now has postponed capital improvements, maintenance, etc.. on the parks that generate most of the cash flow for the parks. They want to increase the revenue from these locations, so the can keep them running smoothly.

Sorry for the long post, but I thought it might be interesting to know some of the back story that drove this move by the Park Service.

 

[Sparky]

Supply and demand. They should charge more for entry.

https://www.yahoo.com/news/us-considers-higher-entry-fees-17-popular-national-214119483.html

Spotted this article last night as well: http://www.mercurynews.com/2017/10/24/70-yosemite-entrance-fee-big-increases-proposed-for-parks/

Although an increase in entrance fee's would help on the individual park level, it's not going to address the fact that the park system as a whole is underfunded. If they do double prices I feel like there needs to be a balance to ensure it's not going to disproportionately effect families that can't afford an admittedly steep access fee. I see the creation of a voucher or wavier program for these individuals which could get increasingly messy and represents a potential for abuse.

I'd be more in favor of a shuttle system for folks without backpacking permits because it tackles the issue of crowds and pollution in the valley at the same time. Being part of the National Park system it'd be nice if it could be entirely nationally subsidized to spread the cost across everyone, not limiting the individual who can't afford an entrance fee.

This is not a fully developed thought, just my initial reaction. I'll have to chew on it some more. Entirely a-political, just looking at the mechanisms.

 

[Jeff Graham]

Spotted this article last night as well: http://www.mercurynews.com/2017/10/24/70-yosemite-entrance-fee-big-increases-proposed-for-parks/

Although an increase in entrance fee's would help on the individual park level, it's not going to address the fact that the park system as a whole is underfunded. If they do double prices I feel like there needs to be a balance to ensure it's not going to disproportionately effect families that can't afford an admittedly steep access fee. I see the creation of a voucher or wavier program for these individuals which could get increasingly messy and represents a potential for abuse.

I'd be more in favor of a shuttle system for folks without backpacking permits because it tackles the issue of crowds and pollution in the valley at the same time. Being part of the National Park system it'd be nice if it could be entirely nationally subsidized to spread the cost across everyone, not limiting the individual who can't afford an entrance fee.

This is not a fully developed thought, just my initial reaction. I'll have to chew on it some more. Entirely a-political, just looking at the mechanisms.

Very little of the money collected at Yosemite, stays at the park. The popularity of Yosemite allows it to fund many national monuments that get very little visitation. The popular parks carry the financial burden for the less popular parks and monuments. The NP Service, like all federal Bureaus, tend to have scope of mission creep. They keep taking on more and more work, that reduces funding from their core mission.

As a visitor to Yosemite, you are also paying for the preservation of Stonewall National Monument the famis Gay bar in New York City. I have never been to Stonewall, I don’t think it will make it to my travel plans in the future. Until it became a monument, I had never heard of it. I have visited the Waco Mammoth National Monument, before it was part of the park service. It was already an established educational facility and a jewel of the Waco community. For years, researchers and schoolkids alike visited the site, and got a glimpse into America’s wild past by learning from this scientifically significant collection of remains. Today, we just get to spend millions more in bureaucracy for the same experience.

 

[000]

I was just talking to a friend of mine about this the other day. In California camping has always been popular especially by the beaches. A few years ago it was possible to find a campsite reservation at most of the medium popular Campgrounds about a month out. Now a days you’re lucky to find anything several months out and forget the very popular Campgrounds like Yosemite unless you reserve on the special day at the special time for the specific dates you want etc... it’s ridiculous. With the state Campgrounds only charging $13.00(last time I checked) to cancel a campsite, I think that more and more people are making multiple reservations as far ahead as allowed and if it works out for them great, and buy them to sell on Craigslist, I see adds for camping passes for the pismo dunes all the time, otherwise they cancel it at the last minute only costing them $13.00. IMO I say no refunds for canceling period, zero exceptions. This will stop the multiple reservation nonsense and people will not clog up the system with last minute cancellations or scalping. It will also leave lots of space available on the fringes of the seasons so people won’t be able to cancel at the last minute because of weather when someone else would’ve happily camped in some weather if the campsite was available. Just my 2 cents


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