The Best Explanation Of Overlanding I've Read

[Hourless Life]

I think a lot of what is in the article jives with some of my thoughts in that I think "overlanding" involves a component of discovery and (for me) discomfort both mental and physical. For the definition of the article that discovery revolves around a level of overlanding that few will actually ever do. The crossing of uncomfortable borders on months long trips in unfamiliar areas, simply the commitment of time for something like that is not available to everyone. It is challenging for sure to be in a vastly different culture with a different language-it can be extremely rewarding and nerve racking at the same time, but the more you do it the less the strangeness bothers you.

I would like to propose a bit of an extension in that for many people the "discovery" is more internal and varies for everyone-for some it is the realization that they don't have to be on their cell phone 24/7, for some the fact that they can make that hike and push themselves, for some it is simply the beauty and tranquility of a starry night by a campfire, and for some, in our current environment, it is simply discovering what connects us all and that our current politics is, perhaps, a lot of noise manufactured to make us forget all those great things that connect us, both at home and in the broader world.

I have met so many great people in my travels from all over the world and consider them my friends-I don't speak their home language, nor eat the same foods, or have the same religion, but I do consider them my friends, but first I had to meet them and talk to them. So pack up, get going, and don't worry what the term is for what you are doing.

Love this Richard. This is the type of discussion I was hoping this thread would create. The idea of discovery and discomfort are really good descriptors for what I believe has a lot to do with overlanding. I may just steal your words. Love this! ~ Eric

 

[DevilDodge]

Maybe Adventurer is a Better Term - easier to Identify with - Easier to explain - and I like the sound of Adventure Bound, When I read the Article it seemed to me he was Defining himself and Placing There group in the 1% of True Overlander's by his definition. Anyway so Yeah for Now on I am an Adventurer seeking fun.

My favorite trim of Dodge Trucks. It is how I identify. Pennsylvania Forest Adventurer.

 

[Hourless Life]

I read this article last night, and have to be honest... it did rub me the wrong way. I understand the point that they’re trying to make... and the distinctions they were trying to point out, but in the world of intent vs. perception, it did come across as... I don’t know if I’d go so far as to say arrogant or elitist... but it kind of came off as a way of saying... no, no, you can’t be included because you haven’t (fill in the blank).

While I agree, the market has taken ahold of the term itself and turned it an industry... statements and definitions like this do create a tier system (which does imply that being an overlander is a club that 99% of us can’t claim to belong to... does that sound elitist?). Again, intent vs. perception.

Definitions do change. And dialects exist. I would argue that the term “4x4 touring”, which is the definition that likely the majority of us belong to, may be widely accepted in countries like South Africa, Australia and England... but in the United States is not. The term “overlanding” here is synonymous with “4x4 touring”.

Some of us do not have the luxury of time, the freedom of a mobile job or the finances to literally walk away from everything for months on end. But i would say the distinction is whether this makes someone a “full-timer” or that someone is on an “expedition”.

As someone who has crossed international borders while living in Europe (where borders are not a big deal), Central America where borders are heavily armed to someone who has crossed a border into combat, where death or permanent injury was a possibility... the accepted risk in crossing an international boundary varies widely. The level of danger a person is willing to accept is personal and can range from low risk to a calculated risk to a stupid risk. Should this define whether a person is an overlander? I don’t think so.

I think as societies are trying to move beyond divisive language, this micro-defining or re-defining of a term widely used is not what is needed in this community. I think this is a bad look. Just wish that this wouldn’t have come from such a highly respected organization within the community.

I hear what you are saying (and thank you for your service. I am a 20 year veteran myself)

I think that there is a push to "protect" the term by defining it from "highly respected" entities within the overlanding community. I believe that is the reason that XO came out with this article. Also the highly respected Overland Journal is on the same page of protecting the term. They are even quoted in the XO article as saying:

"To assist people in determining whether or not they are, in fact, overlanding, Overland Journal suggests asking yourself the following questions:

1. Am I traveling remotely?
2. Am I experiencing a culture unique from my own?
3. Am I visiting an under-explored or under-documented region?
4. Am I traveling self-supported in unfamiliar territories for multiple days, weeks, months, or years?"

Most people don't have the "luxury" or perhaps more accurately, don't make the intentional decisions required to live this hobby as a lifestyle. I don't think either XO or OJ is saying that people can't be part of the community and the hobby. I think they are both trying to make a statement about the fact that overlanding is more than a hobby by definition. It is something to strive for to push yourself to a point of discomfort and discovery to quote another responder here.

Again, I just thought it was good for us as a community here to discuss this. So I really appreciate you taking the time to leave the thoughtful response that you made. ~ Eric

 

[Arailt]

So Overland Journal AND Expedition Overland are both saying that defining the term is important. Also that these are some general guidelines to consider.

Would you agree or disagree?

I think defining overlanding is important to them because their livelihood and identity is wrapped around the concept. They're both selling it, and making it seem exclusive is good for business.

I think actually defining it is irrelevant.

 

[SixOverland]

I read this article last night, and have to be honest... it did rub me the wrong way. I understand the point that they’re trying to make... and the distinctions they were trying to point out, but in the world of intent vs. perception, it did come across as... I don’t know if I’d go so far as to say arrogant or elitist... but it kind of came off as a way of saying... no, no, you can’t be included because you haven’t (fill in the blank).

While I agree, the market has taken ahold of the term itself and turned it an industry... statements and definitions like this do create a tier system (which does imply that being an overlander is a club that 99% of us can’t claim to belong to... does that sound elitist?). Again, intent vs. perception.

Definitions do change. And dialects exist. I would argue that the term “4x4 touring”, which is the definition that likely the majority of us belong to, may be widely accepted in countries like South Africa, Australia and England... but in the United States is not. The term “overlanding” here is synonymous with “4x4 touring”.

Some of us do not have the luxury of time, the freedom of a mobile job or the finances to literally walk away from everything for months on end. But i would say the distinction is whether this makes someone a “full-timer” or that someone is on an “expedition”.

As someone who has crossed international borders while living in Europe (where borders are not a big deal), Central America where borders are heavily armed to someone who has crossed a border into combat, where death or permanent injury was a possibility... the accepted risk in crossing an international boundary varies widely. The level of danger a person is willing to accept is personal and can range from low risk to a calculated risk to a stupid risk. Should this define whether a person is an overlander? I don’t think so.

I think as societies are trying to move beyond divisive language, this micro-defining or re-defining of a term widely used is not what is needed in this community. I think this is a bad look. Just wish that this wouldn’t have come from such a highly respected organization within the community.

I hear what you are saying (and thank you for your service. I am a 20 year veteran myself)

I think that there is a push to "protect" the term by defining it from "highly respected" entities within the overlanding community. I believe that is the reason that XO came out with this article. Also the highly respected Overland Journal is on the same page of protecting the term. They are even quoted in the XO article as saying:

"To assist people in determining whether or not they are, in fact, overlanding, Overland Journal suggests asking yourself the following questions:

1. Am I traveling remotely?
2. Am I experiencing a culture unique from my own?
3. Am I visiting an under-explored or under-documented region?
4. Am I traveling self-supported in unfamiliar territories for multiple days, weeks, months, or years?"

Most people don't have the "luxury" or perhaps more accurately, don't make the intentional decisions required to live this hobby as a lifestyle. I don't think either XO or OJ is saying that people can't be part of the community and the hobby. I think they are both trying to make a statement about the fact that overlanding is more than a hobby by definition. It is something to strive for to push yourself to a point of discomfort and discovery to quote another responder here.

Again, I just thought it was good for us as a community here to discuss this. So I really appreciate you taking the time to leave the thoughtful response that you made. ~ Eric

I respect your opinion as you mine. And thanks for your service as well. One thing to be cautious of though... when XO is quoting OJ, even if XO agrees... OJ is the only source. That’s one opinion or one source. It’s kind of like saying two news articles are saying the same thing so it must be fact... but in reality if one is quoting the other... there is only one source. That’s not corroboration, that’s an echo chamber. It would be different if independent definitions by multiple sources basically say the same thing... which is not the case.

 

[OcoeeG]

I don't think defining things takes anything away from anyone. It sets a standard. It sets a bar. Something that a lot of people want to do that takes a measure of effort to actually accomplish. I mean I want six pack abs but apparently not more than I want a bacon cheeseburger. Haha. I'm saying this to keep it light but there is truth in that.

I love your discussion and appreciate the heart that I'm reading between the lines from you.

Ok, so what am I saying?

I am saying that overlanders are a subset that has taken what most people consider a hobby to another level. But is that a bad thing?

From the article:

"To assist people in determining whether or not they are, in fact, overlanding, Overland Journal suggests asking yourself the following questions:

1. Am I traveling remotely?
2. Am I experiencing a culture unique from my own?
3. Am I visiting an under-explored or under-documented region?
4. Am I traveling self-supported in unfamiliar territories for multiple days, weeks, months, or years?"

So Overland Journal AND Expedition Overland are both saying that defining the term is important. Also that these are some general guidelines to consider.

Would you agree or disagree?

Sure having a standard or setting a bar is fine. But to set that bar at the exact point at which you are currently standing is a bit uppity (sorry, trying to wean myself off of elitist).

 

[NMBruce]

if other people don't think I am overlanding, that is none of my business, I'm having fun doing what I am doing, what ever you want to call it

 

[Ragman]

Just an additional comment. I sort of thought the same thing when the link took me to XO website, not because I think they are bad people or don't have good ideas, but because I see them as primarily film makers. Doesn't mean they don't go to great places and are doing some good things but their history is pretty recent (last decade) and their first series was of "dramatic areas they had traveled in such rugged conditions" which were actually the same roads I traveled on a motorcycle solo in my younger days.

I don't say this to make myself look all legit and grizzled, only that to a lot of people on this forum I expect they are not the final word on overlanding. I know that was not your intent to present them as such but I do think that the source probably set some hair on fire.

That being said I am a long time subscriber to Overland Journal and I do respect that team and their perspectives on the hobby/lifestyle/whatever. They have great articles and, for the most part but slipping I think, pretty well thought out gear reviews along with some stunning photography. I would put Andrew at 4xoverland and Dan Grec as two other sources of information on the topic that I find helpful.

Anyway, just my thoughts.

 

[Hourless Life]

I think defining overlanding is important to them because their livelihood and identity is wrapped around the concept. They're both selling it, and making it seem exclusive is good for business.

I think actually defining it is irrelevant.

I understand your stance but would disagree completely with this. Mostly because I know both the folks behind OJ and the folks at XO. Not sure if you've gotten to know them in person, but their hearts are really for mentoring, helping, assisting, and otherwise supporting those who wish to pursue the lifestyle. They don't have to do this. They don't get paid to do this. They choose to do this. Sure they have businesses around the lifestyle, but sit by a fire with them and get to know them and you may find that you see their motivation a little differently. ~ Eric

 

[Hourless Life]

Sure having a standard or setting a bar is fine. But to set that bar at the exact point at which you are currently standing is a bit uppity (sorry, trying to wean myself off of elitist).

Chris,

If setting the bar is fine, and it is set, then regardless of where you stand there is a way to understand the term. I hear what you are saying and I don't think their intention or heart is to be elitist. I really don't. I think there is a push (and it came far too late) from the generally respected people in the space to really define it so that it actually has meaning.

At the end of the day, most of the folks that I've met who have done extensive overlanding even by this definition are quite humble and helpful and wouldn't really consider themselves better than others, but are definitely "elite" by the sheer journeys they have undertaken under the overlanding banner.

 

[tjZ06]

Oh good, we haven't talked about this yet in the last 13 seconds! I really enjoy XOverland's long-format content (somewhat less the series that focused too much on the ultra-light aircraft stuff), but this is just one more definition nobody asked for. Just get our there and do what makes you happy, who cares what it's called or if it fits in somebody else's definition?

-TJ

 

[Hourless Life]

Just an additional comment. I sort of thought the same thing when the link took me to XO website, not because I think they are bad people or don't have good ideas, but because I see them as primarily film makers. Doesn't mean they don't go to great places and are doing some good things but their history is pretty recent (last decade) and their first series was of "dramatic areas they had traveled in such rugged conditions" which were actually the same roads I traveled on a motorcycle solo in my younger days.

I don't say this to make myself look all legit and grizzled, only that to a lot of people on this forum I expect they are not the final word on overlanding. I know that was not your intent to present them as such but I do think that the source probably set some hair on fire.

That being said I am a long time subscriber to Overland Journal and I do respect that team and their perspectives on the hobby/lifestyle/whatever. They have great articles and, for the most part but slipping I think, pretty well thought out gear reviews along with some stunning photography. I would put Andrew at 4xoverland and Dan Grec as two other sources of information on the topic that I find helpful.

Anyway, just my thoughts.

I don't know Andrew personally, but I appreciate his work in the space. Dan I do know and he's a great guy and has been really kind and helpful to me and my family as we've prepared for our own journey that we're on.

As far as XO. Just like everyone else, there is a lot of history behind the "brand" right? So Clay and Kurt (Kurt much more so) were both part of Expeditions 7 at one point or another. They have a TON of real world background and experience in the overlanding space. At the end of the day we don't have the Albert Podell's of the world here in the forum (to my knowledge) so while I don't present them as the be all end all. I think what they have to say has merit and is worth discussion which is why I brought this up to begin with.

I'm not looking for an echo chamber or people to simply agree. I'm also not looking for anyone to fawn over what they, I, or anyone else has accomplished in the space. I think that there is a move (and the move is far too late) by folks in the industry to "protect" the term so that it has meaning moving forward.

I think that people are always suspicious of the motives behind articles like this, but I personally don't believe that it was an article designed to put more money in their pocket or make them more "famous" or recognizable. I think it was a bold and courageous article, full well knowing they would get flack from it. The XO team decided to make a statement and thus took a stand on what they believe and why. I also feel like they did it in such a way to be inspiring and encouraging. The XO team is an intelligent group of folks and if you get to know them personally have huge hearts and are genuinely caring and supportive of the overlanding community at large. They too have been helpful in our journey as well asking nothing in return for their time and wisdom shared with me and my family.

Appreciate your thoughts and would love to sit by a campfire with you some day and hear some of your stories from your solo travels in your younger days.

~ Eric

 

[Ubiety]

 

[Arailt]

I understand your stance but would disagree completely with this. Mostly because I know both the folks behind OJ and the folks at XO. Not sure if you've gotten to know them in person, but their hearts are really for mentoring, helping, assisting, and otherwise supporting those who wish to pursue the lifestyle. They don't have to do this. They don't get paid to do this. They choose to do this. Sure they have businesses around the lifestyle, but sit by a fire with them and get to know them and you may find that you see their motivation a little differently. ~ Eric

I didn't mean to insinuate that they're not good people. Promoting their business does not make them bad people.

 

[shansonpac]

People ask me this question all the time. What is overlanding?

I've done my best to answer the question. I've even written my own article. I've taken the time to speak with many folks who have made their own incredible overland journeys to try and understand what it is that we do and how best to explain it to others.

This article, written by Expedition Overland (NOT BY ME) agrees with many of the points that I have made in the past on the topic.

I really believe that this article by XO nails it, and that it is well worth a read.

I'd love to hear the thoughts of this community after reading the article and to discuss it.


Article: What is overlanding?

Great article and explanation. By the strict definition, I am not an "overlander." I'm well acquainted with world travel, and have spent many seasons in Guatemala on surgical mission in remote mountain communities experiencing significant hardship, different cultures, and languages. I have no desire to take my rig there. I am all for exploring the road not travelled. Preparing for and meeting challenges. Being a part of a community that cherishes the same. Definitions provide a framework, and are not one size fits all.

True adventure begins when everything starts to go wrong (or when the chance of death is significantly elevated....).

Glad to be a part of this community.

 

[Sylvester]

I wonder if they wrote this article to Invite this kind of scrutiny, Get Ya Talking to them on Gram & Space Book be willing to bet they did it certainly is a decisive take on Overlanding.

You're not a True Overlander unless you're on 40" Tires - Just Saying LOL...

 

[Hourless Life]

Great article and explanation. By the strict definition, I am not an "overlander." I'm well acquainted with world travel, and have spent many seasons in Guatemala on surgical mission in remote mountain communities experiencing significant hardship, different cultures, and languages. I have no desire to take my rig there. I am all for exploring the road not travelled. Preparing for and meeting challenges. Being a part of a community that cherishes the same. Definitions provide a framework, and are not one size fits all.

True adventure begins when everything starts to go wrong (or when the chance of death is significantly elevated....).

Glad to be a part of this community.

Hi Stephen, thanks for your service as a first responder. How is retired life? Sounds like you got a nice set-up with that 4xE and Turtleback. We'll be heading into Guatemala next week and are really looking forward to it. But right now trying to stay present in Belize. Appreciate your comment. Have you connected with Robert D. by chance. He's also part of the herd of turtles and he's out of Death Valley. Great guy. You can find him at @waltzingmatildajt on Instagram if you want to connect. He's always heading over to Trona Pinnacles and the like and he's a first responder as well. Might be a great guy for you to connect with if you haven't already. ~ Eric

 

[Hourless Life]

I wonder if they wrote this article to Invite this kind of scrutiny, Get Ya Talking to them on Gram & Space Book be willing to bet they did it certainly is a decisive take on Overlanding.

You're not a True Overlander unless you're on 40" Tires - Just Saying LOL...

Don't think that is their heart at all. I genuinely believe they feel it is important to define overlanding so that it has meaning beyond a marketing tool. Overland Journal has expressed the same concerns. I think that folks in the community are feeling like they are not being inclusionary but I don't think that is the case at all. I think if you read the article in context it is quite the contrary and they are trying to help people who aspire to take overlanding from a weekend hobby to a more robust lifestyle. From personal experience I can tell you that the teams at both XO and OJ have been super kind and helpful to me and my family for our current journey with no expectation of anything from us. Anyway for what it is worth, I honestly don't believe that they intended for this to be divisive, but at the same time it took a measure of courage to take a stand where it is not politically correct to do so. I'm sure they thought carefully before publishing the article. Also I thought that it was well written and should lead to a sensible discussion. ~ Eric

 

[Sylvester]

Don't think that is their heart at all. I genuinely believe they feel it is important to define overlanding so that it has meaning beyond a marketing tool. Overland Journal has expressed the same concerns. I think that folks in the community are feeling like they are not being inclusionary but I don't think that is the case at all. I think if you read the article in context it is quite the contrary and they are trying to help people who aspire to take overlanding from a weekend hobby to a more robust lifestyle. From personal experience I can tell you that the teams at both XO and OJ have been super kind and helpful to me and my family for our current journey with no expectation of anything from us. Anyway for what it is worth, I honestly don't believe that they intended for this to be divisive, but at the same time it took a measure of courage to take a stand where it is not politically correct to do so. I'm sure they thought carefully before publishing the article. Also I thought that it was well written and should lead to a sensible discussion. ~ Eric

I can't respond to what you wrote with out sounding argumentive, There is so much wrong with it. the entire Article is about what 5% of people have done or can do and 95% wish they could - There is nothing Positive about the way they describe what an Overlander is, in Fact it's harmfull. Truly my Opinion. I think they wrote a divisive article to Get attention and Control the Narrative about Overlanding. There both Very Powerful in UTube and Social Media & Print Media and Easily can sway people's Opinion's and when you control a Narrative you control the Money. I don't find anything Positive in it NOTHING. You want to be Positive You tell People What you drive does'nt matter or how you Overland Does'nt matter "from a weekend Trip to a Month Long trip it's all OVERLANDING - OVERLANDING is Finding something New - it's about seeing the Next State, the Next State Park, The Next National Park - You don't try to set a Bar that can only be Obtained by 5%. THAT is negative and devisive in it's very Nature and Being elitist. We should support overlanding no matter what you drive - where you go or How you do it. OVERLANDING IS TRAVELING - OVERLANDING IS ABOUT SPENDING A WEEKEND WITH FRIENDS - OVERLANDING IS GOING OUT FOR ICE CREAM - IT'S NOT SPENDING A MONTH IN AFRICA - THAT IS A PART OF IT. - THE DEFINTION OF OVERLANDING IS WHAT YOU WANT TO MAKE OT IT - IT'S PERSONAL & PUBLIC, Mostly it should be FUN No mater how you define it.

 

[Hourless Life]

I can't respond to what you wrote with out sounding argumentive, There is so much wrong with it. the entire Article is about what 5% of people have done or can do and 95% wish they could - There is nothing Positive about the way they describe what an Overlander is, in Fact it's harmfull. Truly my Opinion. I think they wrote a divisive article to Get attention and Control the Narrative about Overlanding. There both Very Powerful in UTube and Social Media & Print Media and Easily can sway people's Opinion's and when you control a Narrative you control the Money. I don't find anything Positive in it NOTHING. You want to be Positive You tell People What you drive does'nt matter or how you Overland Does'nt matter "from a weekend Trip to a Month Long trip it's all OVERLANDING - OVERLANDING is Finding something New - it's about seeing the Next State, the Next State Park, The Next National Park - You don't try to set a Bar that can only be Obtained by 5%. THAT is negative and devisive in it's very Nature and Being elitist. We should support overlanding no matter what you drive - where you go or How you do it. OVERLANDING IS TRAVELING - OVERLANDING IS ABOUT SPENDING A WEEKEND WITH FRIENDS - OVERLANDING IS GOING OUT FOR ICE CREAM - IT'S NOT SPENDING A MONTH IN AFRICA - THAT IS A PART OF IT. - THE DEFINTION OF OVERLANDING IS WHAT YOU WANT TO MAKE OT IT - IT'S PERSONAL & PUBLIC, Mostly it should be FUN No mater how you define it.

Hi Timothy,

First let me just say that I appreciate your response and I can clearly "see" your heart and passion for inclusivity in your post. There is some of what you said that I fully agree with and some that I fully disagree with. My response to you is thoughtful and not intended to spark your ire, or upset you and I hope you read it with the heart that I have as well. I appreciate you taking the time to read my thoughts and would love to have a further discussion if you feel so inclined.

1. "We should support overlanding no matter what you drive, where you go, or how you do it." - I agree with this statement. I have run into some amazing overlanders in what are essentially non-4x4 hoopties that looked like they were about to fall apart. They were having a blast and they were out there doing it. A mom and daughter I ran into in Morelia, Mexico who had a rusty VW Van and were making repairs in the parking lot. Pretty amazing ladies!
2. "It's personal, and public, mostly it should be fun no matter how you define it." - Fully agree with this as well. If it isn't enjoyable why do it?

But that is where my agreement with you is at an end.

Overlanding should be defined. If it isn't, then the term has no real meaning.

"The definition of overlanding is what you want to make of it." - This makes no sense to me. This is like the jogger who says he's a marathoner who has never ran a marathon. That is ludicrous. Just because you say you are a marathoner does not make you one. Would you agree? But this is because marathon has a specific definition. Without a specific definition, everyone is a marathoner. Or in this case an overlander.

I think the problem comes in when a group of people who want to "identify" as overlanders feel that a major entity in the space like XO or OJ is telling them they aren't what they think they are and they feel offended or slighted. But that isn't what the hope is. The hope is to help the hobbyist who wants to take it up a notch to achieve their dreams and become part of that smaller group that is actually out there overlanding. I think this was the heart of the article and what XO was conveying.

Overland Journal was quoted in the article by XO as saying:

"To assist people in determining whether or not they are, in fact, overlanding, Overland Journal suggests asking yourself the following questions:

1. Am I traveling remotely?
2. Am I experiencing a culture unique from my own?
3. Am I visiting an under-explored or under-documented region?
4. Am I traveling self-supported in unfamiliar territories for multiple days, weeks, months, or years?"

You say it is because they want to control the narrative. I disagree. I could be wrong. But I do disagree. I've met and personally spent time with the leadership of both and having spent that time and hearing their hearts, I think that both XO and OJ really care about this industry as a whole, not just from a money making perspective, but rather genuinely care enough to take a stance and voice their opinion. I believe that they feel that the definition is important enough to take a stance on which is why XO published this article 6 days ago.

I also believe that both XO and OJ would help anyone who was serious about taking their hobby to the next level. I've experienced this personally. The leadership at both have gone out of their way to help me and my family on our current journey with no expectation in return and never a payment rendered.

Also, overlanding is not going out for ice cream. Just saying. But that one did make me laugh.

Anyway Timothy, I don't think it is about being elitist any more than the marathoner would consider themselves better than the jogger. I think as a general rule marathoners encourage joggers and don't push them to become marathoners, but are willing to help guide and mentor them should they decide to take their jogging to that level.

Personally I love car camping, road tripping, and off roading. Done a lot of all three. And all three can be part of overlanding, but in and of themselves, they are not by definition overlanding. That is if overlanding has a definition.

If not then call yourself whatever you like. But when a jogger who's never run a marathon tells you he's a marathoner, make sure you call him a marathoner.

Hope that makes sense and that you understand why I (and others like XO and OJ) think there is merit in defining the term.

Respectfully,

Eric