OB Approved Safety and Security While Traveling

[PCO6]

Not being in bear country all that often, I'm curious, instead of bear spray and bells, what will you be doing? I've always been told that bells on your backpack bother a bear's ears and they move away from you. Is that bad advice?

Bear bangers are something you might want to consider.

 

[WY_Tigger]

Not being in bear country all that often, I'm curious, instead of bear spray and bells, what will you be doing? I've always been told that bells on your backpack bother a bear's ears and they move away from you. Is that bad advice?

Not an expert, and by no means scientific. There were instances where the bells seemed to actually attract the bears. Similar to when there is a gunshot during hunting season attracting bears.

We had great luck with just being aware of our surroundings and not being quiet. If we had the dog, we kept her close.

For a time I carried an 1895 Guide Gun in 45-70, but a gun is the last resort. Remember that they are attracted by gunshots and that very few guns are effective against a brown bear especially in a charge.

I hope that helps.

 

[Cav 3724]

Agree with Wilbah wholehardly. I retired from law enforcement after 28 years, swat, armorer/range master, active shooter instructor, etc. To say that anyone carrying a weapon with the capability of using it puts everybody within a mile in danger, police included, is an opinion without much substantiation. I find it sad that there would be so little trust and faith in law enforcement, their training and professionalism. When someone commits a crime against you, or anyone for that matter, and they are armed, do you want police armed only with sticks, clubs, pepper spray ? Those things are good if you are within 6 feet or so if the bad guy is not armed. You hold a stick, he holds a gun. We had a saying, don't bring a knife to a gunfight, don't bring your hands to a knife fight. Whether on duty or off duty, I was always armed, still am. I cannot count the times that my firearm had a calming effect on bad guys who either committed crimes or had committed crimes, without anyone getting hurt. If you want to live in a state of green (everyone is good, nothing will ever happen to me or my family), please, be my guest. When that green state turns into a red tide of crap because of an armed bad guy hope you have a stick and really good vocal cords. Let's see how that works for you. But, it's your opinion, your words and you are entitled to both.

 

[Overlandenthusiast]

Having traveled for backpacking, back country discovery, and Overlanding for over 15 years I have developed a mindset around safety and security.

Many of these ideas come from shared experience in travel and a former career as a Law Enforcement Officer of 12 years with 10 years being in SWAT as a sniper, multiple discipline instructor, and operator.

Currently I am a Safety Director for a company and continue to look for ways to keep people safe while completing tasks.

Understanding where I come from I hope provides context for my thoughts on safety and security.

Recently a family was attacked by a wolf in Banf National Forest in Canada.

Traveling internationally the husband did the best he could in my opinion and prevailed.

A family of four was on a camping trip in Canada. Then a wolf attacked while they were sleeping

The family was in Banff National Park in Alberta, Canada, when the incident occurred on August 9, around 1 a.m. local time, according to a report by Parks Canada.

www.cnn.com

Here are some of my thoughts on security and safety while traveling.

Security is a state of mind.

Vigilance and pre-planning is the first step.

Be aware of your surroundings. (What’s around me, who’s around me, what animals are known to be in the area)

If confronted by animal or human always have an escape plan.

Be prepared to fight if flee is not an option. (By fleeing do I put others at risk? Can I escape?)

Fighting (humans or animals) is a dangerous gamble. Especially in the back country. (Injuries can be severe)

If forced into confrontation fight to finish as soon as it is necessary. (Human or Animal the faster the threat is mitigated less likely you incur further injury)

Never go half way. If it is a wild animal or a human, both can cause serious injuries and/or death.

-Firearms-
To carry a firearm is a serious question and should be heavily considered.
There are many who say they will carry a firearm but are ill equipped to use one.
Whether it be the individual’s training and experience and/or their mindset to use a firearm in self defense.

If you choose to have a firearm with you consider the following:
FOLLOW LOCAL, STATE, AND FEDERAL LAWS
IF YOU CAN legally carry a firearm, carry it on you. (Each state has independent laws around reciprocity and carrying)(Anywhere than on your person is too far away in the moment you will need it)
Carry what you are comfortable using and carrying.

-Knives-
FOLLOW LOCAL, STATE, AND FEDERAL LAWS
If you legally can carry a blade you should.
For field and bush work a fixed blade is more versatile.
If you don’t have a fixed blade carry a folder.

-Lights-
Handheld lights can be a dime a dozen.
Get a good tail switch light.
The switch should be momentary only. (Multi-function are not good for self defense)
Lights can be good for blinding animals/people in low light environments
They are also important if you are being forced to defend yourself at night.
If you can have two. Two is one in the light world.

-Training-
Be trained in wilderness training, self defense, and first aid.
Find training to learn backcountry skills: Navigation, gear necessities, survival training, etc..
Push yourself to learn basic self defense skills.

Personal experience has shown, if you have to fight human or animal you WILL have injuries.
Get basic CPR and First Aid training and/or Advanced Wilderness First Aid
Have the means to keep the red in and infections out.
Keep a good first aid kit with you.
Carry a tourniquet and understand when to use it.

This training is great for day to day injuries or assisting with allergic reactions or medical emergencies while in the back country.

-Security-
Security of gear and equipment depends on where I am.
If in the backcountry with my vehicle I don’t lock anything for good reason. It delays me from getting in the truck or getting something else out.
If I must walk away from the vehicle for some distance it is locked. If I am in town passing through and leave my truck I lock it.
I keep a spare key hidden on the truck in case I lose my main key.

-Communication-
Have means to communicate for help.
Whether it be Amatuer Radio, Sat Phone, Garmin InReach, and/or Cellular Device have the means to get additional resources if necessary.
Understand your equipment and its limitations.
Each communication device has it downfall. Know it and have another way to compliment it’s limitations.

-Closing Thoughts-
Knowledge is the best thing you can take with you anywhere.

Best part, it’s also the easiest thing to pack in the vehicle before you go if you take time to educate yourself.

View attachment 113077

Thanks for the information.
It is good to know the basics and have an escape plan.

 

[NMBruce]

In my trips to the north, Canadian and Alaska, I was told many times to bring Bear Spray and I do. I have also read in multiple places, including here that Bear Spray can be used on other animals. OB Approved - Safe Encounters with Wolves (Mammals in North America):

 

[Overlanding Lawyer]

Great post! I think it encourages folks to think in advance before they go, just what is our / my safety and security plan. The single most important factors are common sense and good judgement, if something doesn't seem right, it problem isn't. Listen to yourself, head up, situational awareness, have a plan. I always have my keys to activate the panic alarm as a security option sleeping in camp. The "just get a gun" mindset is flawed, because so few actually spend time training, reviewing use-of-force situations, and think is the end-all answer. If you are going to have a firearm and are LEGALLY able to possess it, do so. Get training, go to the range, spend some $$$ and get great training, and have the conversation with yourself about the use of a firearm to protect yourself or a another person. Always have a quality cutting tool. It's a tool, a cutting and utility tool, not designed or intended to be an offensive or defensive weapon. If so used, it was because you HAD NO OTHER OPTION to defend yourself, that you used a tool. Last item, if you elect to have or carry a gun, spend the money for a good holster or concealment bag. No open carry, don't advertise the fact you are armed, be discreet, especially if you are in an area or place that prohibits firearms. I'm pro 2A, be responsible, be informed, get trained, but mostly, trust your gut, head up, situational awareness combined with common sense and good judgement. Just because you can stand your ground, doesn't mean that's the best or safest course of action. -This is not intended to be legal advice, I am offering my own personal opinions.

 

[K12]

Great post! I think it encourages folks to think in advance before they go, just what is our / my safety and security plan. The single most important factors are common sense and good judgement, if something doesn't seem right, it problem isn't. Listen to yourself, head up, situational awareness, have a plan. I always have my keys to activate the panic alarm as a security option sleeping in camp. The "just get a gun" mindset is flawed, because so few actually spend time training, reviewing use-of-force situations, and think is the end-all answer. If you are going to have a firearm and are LEGALLY able to possess it, do so. Get training, go to the range, spend some $$$ and get great training, and have the conversation with yourself about the use of a firearm to protect yourself or a another person. Always have a quality cutting tool. It's a tool, a cutting and utility tool, not designed or intended to be an offensive or defensive weapon. If so used, it was because you HAD NO OTHER OPTION to defend yourself, that you used a tool. Last item, if you elect to have or carry a gun, spend the money for a good holster or concealment bag. No open carry, don't advertise the fact you are armed, be discreet, especially if you are in an area or place that prohibits firearms. I'm pro 2A, be responsible, be informed, get trained, but mostly, trust your gut, head up, situational awareness combined with common sense and good judgement. Just because you can stand your ground, doesn't mean that's the best or safest course of action. -This is not intended to be legal advice, I am offering my own personal opinions.View attachment 214277View attachment 214278

I agree with this completely. starting with do not open carry, do.not advertise yourself, same with bumper stickers or other affiliations. if you have an NRA sticker or political affiliation it can make you/your vehicle a target.

Also, just because I have a firearm does not mean Its going to be my go to, and no one should have the mind set of going for their firearm first. It is a last resort when all other means have failed. I do not leave my house without a firearm on me, not because I think I will have to use it, but you never know what the world holds that day. I would much rather have it and not need it than need it and not have it. This is like any other piece of recovery gear we being with us, I really hope I never need recovery boards, a jump starter pack, or to use my spare tire. We all care these things for peace of mind in case we need them, but more often than not we dont.

As @Overlanding Lawyer saidmake ssure you train. every piece of gear and equipment you have is worthless if you don't know how to use it.

Just my .02 take it for what its worth.

 

[Overlanding Lawyer]

I agree with this completely. starting with do not open carry, do.not advertise yourself, same with bumper stickers or other affiliations. if you have an NRA sticker or political affiliation it can make you/your vehicle a target.

Also, just because I have a firearm does not mean Its going to be my go to, and no one should have the mind set of going for their firearm first. It is a last resort when all other means have failed. I do not leave my house without a firearm on me, not because I think I will have to use it, but you never know what the world holds that day. I would much rather have it and not need it than need it and not have it. This is like any other piece of recovery gear we being with us, I really hope I never need recovery boards, a jump starter pack, or to use my spare tire. We all care these things for peace of mind in case we need them, but more often than not we dont.

As @Overlanding Lawyer saidmake ssure you train. every piece of gear and equipment you have is worthless if you don't know how to use it.

Just my .02 take it for what its worth.

Thank you Sir,

 

[Michael]

Having traveled for backpacking, back country discovery, and Overlanding for over 15 years I have developed a mindset around safety and security.

Many of these ideas come from shared experience in travel and a former career as a Law Enforcement Officer of 12 years with 10 years being in SWAT as a sniper, multiple discipline instructor, and operator.

Currently I am a Safety Director for a company and continue to look for ways to keep people safe while completing tasks.

Understanding where I come from I hope provides context for my thoughts on safety and security.

Recently a family was attacked by a wolf in Banf National Forest in Canada.

Traveling internationally the husband did the best he could in my opinion and prevailed.

A family of four was on a camping trip in Canada. Then a wolf attacked while they were sleeping

The family was in Banff National Park in Alberta, Canada, when the incident occurred on August 9, around 1 a.m. local time, according to a report by Parks Canada.

www.cnn.com

Here are some of my thoughts on security and safety while traveling.

Security is a state of mind.

Vigilance and pre-planning is the first step.

Be aware of your surroundings. (What’s around me, who’s around me, what animals are known to be in the area)

If confronted by animal or human always have an escape plan.

Be prepared to fight if flee is not an option. (By fleeing do I put others at risk? Can I escape?)

Fighting (humans or animals) is a dangerous gamble. Especially in the back country. (Injuries can be severe)

If forced into confrontation fight to finish as soon as it is necessary. (Human or Animal the faster the threat is mitigated less likely you incur further injury)

Never go half way. If it is a wild animal or a human, both can cause serious injuries and/or death.

-Firearms-
To carry a firearm is a serious question and should be heavily considered.
There are many who say they will carry a firearm but are ill equipped to use one.
Whether it be the individual’s training and experience and/or their mindset to use a firearm in self defense.

If you choose to have a firearm with you consider the following:
FOLLOW LOCAL, STATE, AND FEDERAL LAWS
IF YOU CAN legally carry a firearm, carry it on you. (Each state has independent laws around reciprocity and carrying)(Anywhere than on your person is too far away in the moment you will need it)
Carry what you are comfortable using and carrying.

-Knives-
FOLLOW LOCAL, STATE, AND FEDERAL LAWS
If you legally can carry a blade you should.
For field and bush work a fixed blade is more versatile.
If you don’t have a fixed blade carry a folder.

-Lights-
Handheld lights can be a dime a dozen.
Get a good tail switch light.
The switch should be momentary only. (Multi-function are not good for self defense)
Lights can be good for blinding animals/people in low light environments
They are also important if you are being forced to defend yourself at night.
If you can have two. Two is one in the light world.

-Training-
Be trained in wilderness training, self defense, and first aid.
Find training to learn backcountry skills: Navigation, gear necessities, survival training, etc..
Push yourself to learn basic self defense skills.

Personal experience has shown, if you have to fight human or animal you WILL have injuries.
Get basic CPR and First Aid training and/or Advanced Wilderness First Aid
Have the means to keep the red in and infections out.
Keep a good first aid kit with you.
Carry a tourniquet and understand when to use it.

This training is great for day to day injuries or assisting with allergic reactions or medical emergencies while in the back country.

-Security-
Security of gear and equipment depends on where I am.
If in the backcountry with my vehicle I don’t lock anything for good reason. It delays me from getting in the truck or getting something else out.
If I must walk away from the vehicle for some distance it is locked. If I am in town passing through and leave my truck I lock it.
I keep a spare key hidden on the truck in case I lose my main key.

-Communication-
Have means to communicate for help.
Whether it be Amatuer Radio, Sat Phone, Garmin InReach, and/or Cellular Device have the means to get additional resources if necessary.
Understand your equipment and its limitations.
Each communication device has it downfall. Know it and have another way to compliment it’s limitations.

-Closing Thoughts-
Knowledge is the best thing you can take with you anywhere.

Best part, it’s also the easiest thing to pack in the vehicle before you go if you take time to educate yourself.

View attachment 113077

“It’s the easiest thing to pack in the vehicle” love this.

 

[Overlanding Lawyer]

“It’s the easiest thing to pack in the vehicle” love this.

Great advice

 

[RedMochi]

This is a great thread, I like reading what others think about self protection while out in the wilderness or just being outside.

Very good advises about being aware of your surrounding, use common sense (lost art now a days), and using lethal weapon as the very last resort after trying everything else.

Al though, when you're in a dangerous situation, everyone reacts a little different even with plenty of training (it is the fight or flight reaction)...Training with the weapon of your choice and staying calm is the key, but it is going to be difficult to stay calm since you can only train so much for some situations and not all.

I live in a state where it is difficult to get a CCW, so having a gun while out in the wilderness is not allowed...I am a pro 2A myself and it is very frustrating that I can't have my weapon with me if I need it.

I always have a sharp knife with me and I bring a take down bow and arrow just in case.

Be aware of your surrounding, deescalate the situation if one can not avoided it, and carry a big stick (Your choice for self defense).

Just my opinion...Stay safe out there, enjoy the outdoors, and leave it better than how you find it.

 

[DaJudge]

Along with situational awareness is being willing to just move on. If you have even the remotest concern about a situation whether it is because of humans, animals, etc., just do something different. Sometimes we force things because we have traveled a long ways to visit an area but keeping yourself and your family safe is more important than camping at the spot you have been wanting to visit for ten years.