Noob question regarding a full-size SUV and suspension upgrades

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OBiE0311

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Alrighty! I have run into a bit of a conundrum regarding suspension and travel.

We currently have a 95 Suburban K1500 and we need to replace the shocks anyway. I was thinking of trying to find some more robust off-road shocks and spend the extra money for a bit better experience, but I'm also wondering about lifting the vehicle. I know I'd like to be able to do some off-roading and get to some cool places that way, and right now on the stock suspension the Burb won't be doing what I see so many other people doing in those fancy photos!

So ultimately I'm wondering if just upgrading the shocks will be good enough or if I need to add a lift? I wouldn't want to go more than 2" and I saw a decent looking kit for $650 from Rough Country that includes shocks and an add-a-leaf.

Thoughts?
 
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TerryD

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With a little bit of torsion bar crank, you can fit 285/75/16 tires pretty easily on factory wheels. I have them on my OBS 2000 K2500.

As for shocks, get the Bilstein shocks that came on the Z71 K1500 trucks. I ran the Monroe Reflex mono-tube shocks on our 1999 K1500 Suburban and they did a great job.

The issue with the torsion key lifts is that you'll limit the amount of down travel you have and you put some stress on your tie rods and CVs at the steeper angle. If you go that route, be careful not to max it out and ruin your ride. I don't think you'll need a longer shock for the front (still not limiting down travel) and the truck rear shocks are longer than the Tahoe/Suburban, but only by about an inch if I remember correctly.

The next step up for a GMT400 is a drop bracket kit and the shortest one I think you can get is a 4". This is a very involved kit. Check out OffRoad Design, they sell a front drop bracket kit and have a shackle flip for the rear that works much better offroad than lift blocks that normally come with kits that size.
 
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OBiE0311

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So I guess the next question would be how important, overall, would a lift be? Is there enough ground clearance on the rig now to be able to do some beginner off-roading? If I get upgraded shocks, either the Monroes or the Bilsteins, am I good to go or will I really risk damaging the rig without the extra travel? I already put the biggest tires I could fit on it without wheel rub, but the exact size escapes me.
 

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Whether a lift is important or not depends on what you are wanting to do with it. I don't know what kinds of trails you are
interested in. I would suggest you getting out there and trying it as is and seeing if you want more from it or if you are happy.

The shocks for the Z71 (Bilstein or Monroe equivalent) won't damage the rig. You are limited by suspension travel in the front and the shock is designed to work within those limits, lifted or not. The rear is a slightly different story, but as long as you aren't bottoming out the shock (shock too long and limits compression travel, will usually bend the shock) you should be fine.
 
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Smileyshaun

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I know they are kinda taboo but I have never had a issue with a small body lift , 1-2" will give you the extra room for tires but keep your ride stock smooth . Unless you have alot of rust then I would steer clear of it
 

TerryD

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That's the right ones, Bilstein 4600s IIRC. They made the original Z71 shocks but GM had then painted red. Let me double check the part numbers here in a few and I'll make sure.
 
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Kent R

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I have nothing to add to this conversation other than this is one of the main reasons I joined Overland Bound, members helping members!
 

TerryD

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OK, so my memory isn't perfect, go figure! :smiley:

The K1500 rear shocks are 1.5" longer fully compressed than the Tahoe/Suburban (Tahoe: 14.6" vs K1500: 16.1"). That translates to them being good if you run a short AAL in the rear or extend your bump stops to make sure they don't bottom out on you and bend a shock. This would help if you were having issues with your rear tires digging into your wheel wells. You could also use a ORD 1" Zero rate add a leaf (basically a short lift block) in the rear and add another 1/2" spacer under your bump stop to gain some rear lift, not affect ride quality, and run the K1500 shocks to keep wheel travel at basically stock numbers in the rear.

You could then give your torsion bars about 4 full turns (on my K2500 it was 4 turn = 1") and have it realigned and you'll have a very mild but useable 1-1.5" lift all around and the right shocks to to deal with it but still be able to buy replacement parts at any parts house you come to along the way.

OR:

A quick search of Rockauto.com shows that they list the 4600 series Bilstein shocks with factory Tahoe/Suburban numbers so you don't have to worry about ANY of this. HAHA! :grinning:
 

OBiE0311

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Thanks for doing the leg work on that! That’s some great info! I’ll be getting the shocks replaced in the next week or so for sure so this is a HUGE help!
 
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TerryD

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Thanks for doing the leg work on that! That’s some great info! I’ll be getting the shocks replaced in the next week or so for sure so this is a HUGE help!
Glad I could help! The GMT400 is my FAVORITE truck platform. I've spent a good chunk of time researching them and I've owned 3 so far. I remember going through this trying to buy shocks for our 99 Suburban and trying to figure out the best shock option for the best price so I had some faint memories. I've got to put shocks on my K2500 this summer as well as rebuild the steering system. It likes to wander around in the road, which at 80mph can be exciting!
 
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OBiE0311

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Hey Terry, I figured I’d ask here instead of starting a whole new thread, but what would your honest assessment of the Suburban’s off-road capabilities be? Is it worth building the rig on this platform? My wife and I are looking at getting an off-road camping trailer but I’m wondering if we’d be better suited to just getting a new rig instead. If the Suburban is up to snuff, then I’d probably just prefer to build onto it but I don’t want to if it’s not going to be able to do any off-roading.
 

TerryD

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Well, I'm not sure how your off-roading compares with my off-roading. I come from the more hard-core rock-crawling end of things. Plus, I live on the east coast where trails are tight and covered in brush most of the time. My last wheeler was a double locked K5 on 35's and reckless disregard for the body. The Xterra I'm a little more careful with but I'm still looking to have lockers in both ends, 2-3" lift and 33's.

What kinds of off-roading are you wanting to do? Are you perfectly happy going across forest service roads and want to be prepared if they get a little rough along the way or are you going to be actively seeking more challenging routes where most of your day is spent in 4-lo?

The range of what people want to do is so broad here, it's hard to say for sure if it'll work out for you or not. I don't like to even offer an opinion before I get to know someone. I never recommend just lifting something "because". Every modification comes with drawbacks that affect the whole vehicle. You kinda have to decide for yourself if what you want from it is a reasonable expectation.

Describe an "ideal" overland experience for you with your trailer and lets see if I can get an idea of what you're looking to get from it.
 

OBiE0311

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Traveler I

I appreciate it in advance!

Basically I’m thinking that it would be cool to be able to get to places that we normally wouldn’t get to see from just the road. Im planning a trip to Moab and I’d like to be able to do something like Maze Overlook or Flint Trail. Basically I think that it would be cool to be able to get off the beaten path to set up camp. We’ve got trips planned to Puget Sound and Olympia National Park plus things like the Grand Canyon National park. I’d love to be able to do the Washington Discovery Trail and then stuff closer to home like Ouray, Colorado. We have talked about doing some of the meet ups and would like to be able to keep up with a typical over landing group (whatever that may mean...seems vague even to me). Nothing extreme as we will have a trailer (an extremely capable trailer, but still a trailer), so no rock climbing or anything that poses a serious risk to the vehicle. I also have to be careful as this is likely to be my daily driver as well, so no matter what it is I can’t do anything that would pose a serious risk to the vehicle.

I guess ultimately, at least in general, the goal would be to use the rig primarily for getting to some really cool camping spots. Is that helpful? I feel like I may have even confused myself there!
 

TerryD

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Ok, I'm not familiar with any of those trails so I had to look them up on YouTube to see what they are like. There was a video of a stock GMT400 on a couple little ledges on the Maze Overlook and I think with a little work, your Suburban will do great for you.

My thoughts on it are this:

Do the budget lift I was talking about earlier. Probably use an actual add-a-leaf if you plan on trailering as it will also up your capacity a touch in the rear. I wouldn't try to go very big on lift, about 1.5" at most in front, let the rear go where it wants with a 2" AAL. Then you'll want the better shocks as well. 4600 Bil's should do good for you.

For tires, some nice A-T like BFG KO2s in 285/75/16 on stock wheels. There are a few companies that make tire and jerry can carrier rear bumpers for these vehicles with good protection and an integrated hitch that'll gain you some departure angle.

You'll probably want to eventually invest in a front bumper capable of holding a 12k or 15k winch. You'll want enough to extract the Burb then turn around and be able to winch your trailer out if it's hung as well.

I would consider finding a rear axle from a light duty K2500 from the mid 90's. It'll be a semi-float 14b with six lug axles so your factory wheels will fit. It's worlds stronger than your current 10b rear and will stand the strain of towing an off-road trailer. You should be able to sell your 10b easy enough if you have a bit of patience. The front should be fine if you can get a 14b that matches the ratio you have, which I'm pretty certain would be 3.73. It is the more common of the ratios. You might consider adding an ARB to the rear while you are in it. Then you can get the mid-range ARB compressor and have on board air as well as a rear locker should you need it. That's a good chunk of change that you can hold off on till you see if you NEED it though, but I probably would if I was building it myself. That's my opinion though, go with what you feel good about.

Your Burb is a 95, so I'm not sure if you have the TBI 350 or the Vortec 350. Either way, you need to get your entire coolant system flushed now if you haven't already. The OE Dexcool attacks aluminum if it's over 7 years old. I've seen it eat intakes till they start leaking. If you have the Vortec engine, you need to find out if the intake gaskets have been changed yet. These engines are bad about breaking the intake gaskets and filling the cylinders with coolant. It's happened to both my 99 Suburban (cost me an engine) and my 00 K2500 (caught it right as it started).

You should also have the transmission fluid changed (not flushed) and the shift solenoids replaced with OE (AC Delco from a Chevy dealer) ones before one of them costs you your transmission (again, killed the trans in my 99 Burb). These are common issues with the 4L60E transmisson and because of the way they work in conjunction with each other, losing just one basically cripples the transmission.

I know those seem like major issues, but they really aren't. Every vehicle has it's weaknesses. My Xterra came to me with a new transmission after a common issue with them killed it. I also had to have timing chain tensioners done because of a factory defect. You have the Suburban and from what I saw of the trails in the videos, you'll do fine on them in it, even with a trailer, after you get the experience behind the wheel and know your truck.
 

OBiE0311

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Traveler I

Terry, you’re a legend! Thanks! I’ve done a few of these things already, but it’s good to have a solid list of goals to work for! Seriously, thank you!
 
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TerryD

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You're more than welcome! I think that setup would be great for you. By all means though, go research for yourself to see if you agree with me. This is just my thoughts based on what I know about the GMT400 and what I saw in the videos of where you want to go with it.