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pabloquiros

pabloquiros

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Hi Everyone!

This post is going to be long, and I'm sorry about that, the substance is at the bottom if anyone wants to help a new guy out :). In short, I'd like to hear opinions and suggestions from more experienced people.

I'm going to start with a small intro that will hopefully make sense as to why I have all these questions.

I lived in Central America most of my life, just moved back to the states a few years ago. Did a significant amount of overlanding back home, but did it with a 79 Blazer K5 that was beat to shit.

Now I just moved to California and got a new Tacoma TRD Sport DC/SB. Never owned a Toyota before, least of all modified it. I sure don't want to ruin/do things wrong. So I have a ton of questions that I was hoping I could get some help with. If this is the wrong forum please excuse me, I can repost in the right place.

Lift

I have been considering several kits, but these are the top options. Any insight is appreciated. (Also if you know of anything cheaper PLEASE tell me, lol).

They all seem to be 2.75 - 3 Inches though, and these are my questions:

1. does everyone run 3 Inches on tacomas?
2. and anything more than that requires cutting the front cross member to drop the diff right?
3. Are most of you guys running AAL+whatever shocks in the back plus the coilovers in the front?
4. Is most of this stuff bolt on, or am I going to be forced to seriously maul the original frame?
5. And how necessary is it to replace the UCA's?
6. If I wanted anything over 3/4 inches, I'd have to cut that cross member right?
7. How do you guys feel about spacers?

http://toyteclifts.3dcartstores.com/OME-TAK16--OME-Tacoma-Suspension-lift-kit-for-2016-Tacoma_p_1595.html#

http://toyteclifts.3dcartstores.com/UL-FOXTA05--Fox-Ultimate-suspension-for-05-Tacoma_p_1226.html

http://toyteclifts.3dcartstores.com/ICON-Stage-4-Tacoma-Suspension-with-Tubular-UCAs_p_1432.html

http://iconvehicledynamics.com/shop/2016-up-toyota-tacoma-complete-suspension-systems/1070-2016-up-toyota-tacoma-0-275-suspension-system-stage4-w-tubular-uca.html

8. Bumpers

I don't really have any questions about this, I kinda like how the C4 ones fit on the Taco, so I'm thinking of going with their bumpers. Any suggestions or comments are appreciated.

http://www.c4fabrication.com/product/2016-tacoma-3rd-gen-overland-series-high-clearance-rear-bumper-system/

http://www.c4fabrication.com/product/2016-tacoma-3rd-gen-overland-series-front-bumper-full-size-no-cut/

9. Sliders

http://www.cbioffroadfab.com/products/3rd-gen-toyota-tacoma/bolt-on-rock-sliders-3rd-gen-tacoma/

10. Roof Rack - Bed Rack - Tent

I'm not sure what tent is the best, or what bed rack is the best, but I'd appreciate the feedback

http://www.carid.com/go-rhino/go-rhino-roof-rack-153522041.html

http://www.carid.com/fab-fours/fab-fours-roof-rack-104150726.html

http://www.cbioffroadfab.com/products/3rd-gen-toyota-tacoma/3rd-gen-overland-tacoma-bed-rack/


Thank you so much whoever takes the time to read this and comment, I appreciate the help, I live in somewhat of a small place (San Luis Obispo), and I cant seem to find anyone local to talk about this kind of stuff, and learn.

Picture of my ride as it is, for reference. 2016/TRDS/DC/SB/285/70/17
13715055_1546237889019075_140287633_n.jpg
 
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SLO Rob

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Mademan925

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1. does everyone run 3 Inches on tacomas?
People usually run 2-3 inches of lift because any more requires a drop bracket which is bolt on but compromises the strength of the front end and the reliability. It also doesn't allow for ground clearance as it just drops everything down making the vehicle taller so you can fit larger tires. This also makes the vehicle more top heavy on the trails.
2. and anything more than that requires cutting the front cross member to drop the diff right?
no. most drop brackets these days are bolt on.
3. Are most of you guys running AAL+whatever shocks in the back plus the coilovers in the front?
many people run an add a leaf in the rear but if you plan on adding a bed rack/camping gear/ roof top tent you will need a new leaf pack. The most common heavy duty leaf packs are the ome dakars and the allpro expo leaf pack. Keep in mind if you don't have additional weight these leaf packs will ride very harsh.
4. Is most of this stuff bolt on, or am I going to be forced to seriously maul the original frame?
Most everything is bolt on including sliders, bumpers, skids.
5. And how necessary is it to replace the UCA's?
It is only necessary to replace UCA's if you have extended travel coilovers (king/ fox/ icon) or if you cant get a good alignment a 3 inches of lift. Some people also replace them if they run stock rims with 33s because the tires will rub the stock ucas with stock rims.
6. If I wanted anything over 3/4 inches, I'd have to cut that cross member right?
no
7. How do you guys feel about spacers?
I have seen multiple shocks snap due to spacers in person. If you want to drive off pavement I strongly suggest you don't do spacers or blocks. I recommend coilover shock with adjustability (king/ fox/ icon) that way if you add weight (bumpers) later you can compensate by adjusting the suspension.

http://toyteclifts.3dcartstores.com/OME-TAK16--OME-Tacoma-Suspension-lift-kit-for-2016-Tacoma_p_1595.html#

http://toyteclifts.3dcartstores.com/UL-FOXTA05--Fox-Ultimate-suspension-for-05-Tacoma_p_1226.html

http://toyteclifts.3dcartstores.com/ICON-Stage-4-Tacoma-Suspension-with-Tubular-UCAs_p_1432.html

http://iconvehicledynamics.com/shop/2016-up-toyota-tacoma-complete-suspension-systems/1070-2016-up-toyota-tacoma-0-275-suspension-system-stage4-w-tubular-uca.html

8. Bumpers

I don't really have any questions about this, I kinda like how the C4 ones fit on the Taco, so I'm thinking of going with their bumpers. Any suggestions or comments are appreciated.

I recommend Pelfreybilt. They are an awesome husband a wife who make amazing products. Also relentless but the lead times are kinda long right now.

http://www.c4fabrication.com/product/2016-tacoma-3rd-gen-overland-series-high-clearance-rear-bumper-system/

http://www.c4fabrication.com/product/2016-tacoma-3rd-gen-overland-series-front-bumper-full-size-no-cut/

9. Sliders

I recommend Pelfreybilt. They are an awesome husband a wife who make amazing products. Also relentless but the lead times are kinda long right now.

http://www.cbioffroadfab.com/products/3rd-gen-toyota-tacoma/bolt-on-rock-sliders-3rd-gen-tacoma/

10. Roof Rack - Bed Rack - Tent

Prinsu makes the best roof rack on the market. Bay area metal fab makes some awesome bed racks. Tepui has the best tents in my opinion and they are located in santa cruz. If you get a bedrack from bamf he will probably get you a discount on the tent as he is a retailer.

I'm not sure what tent is the best, or what bed rack is the best, but I'd appreciate the feedback

http://www.carid.com/go-rhino/go-rhino-roof-rack-153522041.html

http://www.carid.com/fab-fours/fab-fours-roof-rack-104150726.html

http://www.cbioffroadfab.com/products/3rd-gen-toyota-tacoma/3rd-gen-overland-tacoma-bed-rack/
 
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Mademan925

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Many of the products you pick above are awesome. If you have any specific questions about a certain one feel free to ask. I have had the toytec lift kit, icon stage 4, fox long travel with allpro arms , and king long travel with TC arms.
 
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Arailt

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Hi Pablo!

Seems like Mademan has you pretty well covered. I just have a few small things to add.

1.) Like Mademan said, most folks run 3" of lift or less. This is because going over 3" generally causes the front driveshaft CV angles to be too extreme and also because the factory independent front suspension down travel is nearly maxed out at 3" of lift.

However... and this is a big however, that information applies somewhat specifically to second generation Tacomas (2005-2015). The third generation (2016+) has almost identical suspension components to the second generation, but uses a different front coil/strut combination that gives it a 1" lift from the factory when compared to the second generation. Essentially, that means a 2" lift on your 2016 Tacoma would be similar to a 3" lift on a second generation, so anything over 2" will start to cause you problems.

Here is a quote from Toytec Lifts explaining the situation:
The 05-15 Tacoma on average measures 20 inches in the front and 21.5 inches in the rear. The 16 Tacoma measures 21 inches in the front and 22 inches in the rear.

So being that the control arm/shock/spindle configuration is nearly identical to the 05-15, this means that the front of the 3rd gen actually sits 1 inch higher in the shock travel range. We were able to confirm this by doing a hub-to-fender measurement at full droop (24.5 inches for both the 2nd gen and the 3rd gen) and doing a measurement while sitting on the ground (20 inches for the 2nd gen, 21 inches for the 3rd gen), we can see that the 2nd gen factory suspension compressed 4.5 inches to get to ride height and the 3rd gen compressed 3.5 inches to get to ride height. Full droop stayed the same. The 3rd gens just did not compress as much.

So i bet you are asking what that means for lifting and why would i even care?

Well since the suspension is now 1 inch higher is the travel range, its actually 1 inch "lift" from the factory. The limit of the suspension is still the same 3 inches of lift so this means that over a factory 2016, you can only do a true 2 inch over how it comes from the factory. Technically you could adjust some coilovers to the full 3 inches of lift over factory but then you would end up with hardly any down travel left in the coilover and you are going to be hitting full extension on the shock all the time.
Click to expand...
2.) Differential drops and "drop bracket lifts" are two different ways to correct CV angles and down travel issues when lifting your Tacoma.
  • A differential drop is a simple spacer that drops the front differential ~1" and does not require cutting the factory cross member. It relocates the differential to return the drive shafts to a closer-to-factory position to alleviate stress on the CV joints. **This is generally frowned upon for heavy off road use because lowering the differential exposes it to obstacles like rocks and tree stumps. Also, installing a diff drop kit can cause issues with skid plate installation.
  • A drop bracket lift is a lift essentially does the same thing, but to a much greater degree and does require cutting the frame and removing the factory cross member to install. See BDS install instructions HERE and Fabtech install instructions HERE. Drop bracket lifts are also frowned upon for heavy off road use as they weaken the structural integrity of the factory frame and leave the new cross member (drop bracket) very exposed.
8 & 9.) I agree with Mademan. Pelfreybilt makes some of the sweetest looking bumpers and sliders for the Tacoma.

In my opinion, Pelfrey and CBI are the only two that make good looking bumpers for the 3rd gen Tacoma. Both companies do with or without headlight hoops.
 
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Mademan925

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Burgh said:
Hi Pablo!

Seems like Mademan has you pretty well covered. I just have a few small things to add.

1.) Like Mademan said, most folks run 3" of lift or less. This is because going over 3" generally causes the front driveshaft CV angles to be too extreme and also because the factory independent front suspension down travel is nearly maxed out at 3" of lift.

However... and this is a big however, that information applies somewhat specifically to second generation Tacomas (2005-2015). The third generation (2016+) has almost identical suspension components to the second generation, but uses a different front coil/strut combination that gives it a 1" lift from the factory when compared to the second generation. Essentially, that means a 2" lift on your 2016 Tacoma would be similar to a 3" lift on a second generation, so anything over 2" will start to cause you problems.

Here is a quote from Toytec Lifts explaining the situation:


2.) Differential drops and "drop bracket lifts" are two different ways to correct CV angles and down travel issues when lifting your Tacoma.
  • A differential drop is a simple spacer that drops the front differential ~1" and does not require cutting the factory cross member. It relocates the differential to return the drive shafts to a closer-to-factory position to alleviate stress on the CV joints. **This is generally frowned upon for heavy off road use because lowering the differential exposes it to obstacles like rocks and tree stumps. Also, installing a diff drop kit can cause issues with skid plate installation.
  • A drop bracket lift is a lift essentially does the same thing, but to a much greater degree and does require cutting the frame and removing the factory cross member to install. See BDS install instructions HERE and Fabtech install instructions HERE. Drop bracket lifts are also frowned upon for heavy off road use as they weaken the structural integrity of the factory frame and leave the new cross member (drop bracket) very exposed.
8 & 9.) I agree with Mademan. Pelfreybilt makes some of the sweetest looking bumpers and sliders for the Tacoma.

In my opinion, Pelfrey and CBI are the only two that make good looking bumpers for the 3rd gen Tacoma. Both companies do with or without headlight hoops.
Click to expand...
Dang you really do have to cut that. Ive looked under a few drop bracket trucks. Never noticed that. Why would someone do that?
 
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pabloquiros

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Thanks again guys. @Burgh @Mademan925 !

That's more or less what i have been reading, i cringe at the thought of having to cut the cross member, so i think I'm going to do a 3" suspension lift with AAL in the back plus new shocks and new coilovers in the front with new UCA's as well.

My blazer had a 8 inch lift but there was no cutting involved, obviously this is because of a different frame architecture but its the only modification experience i have, so this is all pretty helpful.

How do you feel about wheel spacers? thats what i meant in my original post, not frame blocks or spaces but wheel ones, to make the wheel stick out a little more and not hit the new UCA's (since I'm still using stock rims).

I did in fact start looking at pelfrebilt and BAMF, the lead times are significant though so i am still thinking what i want, I'm probably going to wind up with a frankenstein mix of manufactures because i want some features from one and not the other (like the read tire swing arm and high clearance rear bumper from C4, but the front aluminum bumper from PF and the skids from BAMF. I haven't found a bed rack that i love, i feel they are all too short in length, so the bed looks weird but still looking, might even have something made, theres a place here in SLO called NVfab which seems to be good at this kind of stuff.

I am actually driving to Paso tomorrow to go check out a place called "TAPS" that say they are suspension experts, see if they have stock or insight and maybe get a lift put in place this weekend. No cutting or drop brackets hehe.

Just to reiterate, that should serve my purpose right?

Front new shocks with heavy duty coils and new UCA's, no spacers or blocks of any sort. This should give me 2.75 inches in the front if i use the fox set.

AAL in the back plus new shocks should give me 2.75 lift in the back but shitty under load, once i have bumpers and cage/tent, id be getting a whole new leaf pack instead.
 
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pabloquiros

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Burgh said:
Good question. I think they're for mall crawlers who want to run the maximum tire size with minimal effort and no regard for cost. I'd never trust it off road.
Click to expand...
I agree, I'm not the kind of guy to diss another dude's truck, but you do see a lot of bro-ish trucks around here where i live, mostly giant lifts with absurdly big rims and shaved down offroad tires, and what they all have in common is that drop bracket/reinforcement piece right in-front or around the front diff. When I started looking into lifts for my taco i came across a lot of those kinds of kits and i felt weird about having to cut a cross member, so i am glad i wasn't wrong. I wouldn't trust that, or lift blocks for offroading EVER.
 
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pabloquiros

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Mademan925 said:
Wheel spacers ok if hub centric and installed correctly. I recommend bora and spydertrax.
Click to expand...
I was looking at spidertrax, so good deal. I may try to get some in this weekend. current setup there is some rub with the UCA when completely turned, minimal with no tire sidewall damage but still existent.
 
pabloquiros

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Burgh said:
^This. Either are great options. Also, make sure you use Loctite Blue 242 when you install. Don't want your a wheel falling off on the highway.
Click to expand...
So I saw that as part of the spidertrax kit, what is it for? the nuts that tie the spacer to the wheel assembly? i'd hate to think that once you put these on they are a permanent fixture of the vehicle?
 
Mademan925

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pabloquiros said:
So I saw that as part of the spidertrax kit, what is it for? the nuts that tie the spacer to the wheel assembly? i'd hate to think that once you put these on they are a permanent fixture of the vehicle?
Click to expand...
Its used to bond the spacer to the stock lugs. Easily removable with a 10 dollar blow torch and a wrench. I have taken them off several times.
 
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