Leave No Trace - Remember?

[RescueRangers]

So I get up this morning and figured I would watch a video or two on Youtube before I started my day. I ran across a video with "Overland Bound" in the title and thought that would be a great video to watch. By the time I got a quarter of the way through the video I was so disgusted I had to force myself to finish watching it. I will be polite and not call people out but they either don't understand what "Leave No Trace" or "Tread Lightly" is, or don't care to follow it. The video showed a number of people driving in wet lands (and getting massively stuck) and blazing new trails. I was really surprised to see a number of vehicles parked in a lake just to get a cool picture (I am giving them the benefit of doubt that they were not washing the mud off their vehicles in the lake).

Most of the off-road organizations I have been involved in preach Tread Lightly because they don't want to risk losing access to public lands (which this video was taken on). I have always had a problem with these organizations because their understanding of these principles only seem to go as far as "don't screw it up for everyone" but in general don't seem to care about the principles.

I have always seen Overlanders as being different. Overlanders embrace the principles of Leave No Trace and Treadly Lightly because it is nature itself that is the attraction. I heard repeatedly to air down so you don't leave holes on the trail from spinning or create corrigation on the trail. Or there is the more widely discussed "Pack it in - Pack it out" as well as leave it better than you found it. I've always seen Overlanding as having a higher standard of conduct than off-roaders primarily because their purpose is appreciation of the land they are on. Has Overlanding gotten so popular that their standard of conduct has dropped, or are we getting people involved in the Overland community that just don't get what Overlanding is about?

I think the biggest principle the people in the video missed is "Leave it as you found it". To me what they did was no better than the kid who scribes his name in the middle of the 2,000 year old rock painting.

 

[LostInSocal]

It's a mixed bag when it comes to those who calls themselves "overlanders". Having car-camped for many, many years, I only discovered last year I was overlanding the whole time. :) I agree with most that you've said, but you're pretty much preaching to the choir posting in this forum.

 

[DCFISK]

I agree with you. I was in a National Forest last weekend, and we found a great to camp that looked like it had been used before (rock fire ring left intact). Once we started to set up camp, we started to notice all of the plastic, beer cans, and trash left behind by previous campers. It's pretty frustrating to see that others do not respect what is left of our world's natural beauty........

 

[luchaDor]

I took the OP's post to mean that an Overland Bound video was showing some habitat destruction and environmental damage done during an official outing. Parking in a lake for a picture (not cool), going off trail, etc, etc. So, I believe the point was to remind folks of the 'Leave no trace' credo when overlanding...I've not seen the lake picture or video, so I might be totally wrong too.

 

[OffroadTreks]

but you're pretty much preaching to the choir posting in this forum.

Are you really? How many people are guilty of the "COOL RIG SPLASHING THROUGH WATER" shot. There are like over 50 in the Rig Photos. And technically, you shouldn't do that if you really want to practice tread lightly. Aside from the obvious that could happen if you suck up water, it causes erosion.

Many of you might think, no harm no foul. But enough of it, and it leads to problems.

A lot of areas out west are coming under threat of closure as people continue to go off trail and liter and basically just tear things up. If you see something, say something. Seriously, it's ok BE that person.

We need to police ourselves and others.

Find better ways to get instafamous without tearing it up.

 

[4wheelspulling]

That is why we can help educate others on proper off-road etiquette, through this forum and by our example! It's a learning curve for everyone. I am glad I was taught at an early age to respect nature and leave a place cleaner than I found it when camping. Tread lightly, while off-roaring. These are skills that can be learned! Benz.

 

[LostInSocal]

Are you really? How many people are guilty of the "COOL RIG SPLASHING THROUGH WATER" shot. There are like over 50 in the Rig Photos. And technically, you shouldn't do that if you really want to practice tread lightly. Aside from the obvious that could happen if you suck up water, it causes erosion.

Point taken. You don't look at some of these rig photos and think they're tip-toe'ing on the trails.

 

[craigR]

I fully remember Leave No Trace and Tread Lightly, as both came to the forefront when I started exploring and camping many years ago. Being an advocate of both following rules and respecting nature, I adhere to as much proper "nature" and "off road" etiquette as I possibly can.

That said, I can't say I've been a perfect driver over the years. Some have been mishaps and others have been poor judgment. Both, however, where products of inexperience at the time, rather than lack of respect or malicious intent. Like anything else in life, the key is to learn from our mistakes, and do better the next time.

I have a National Forest about 10 minutes away. I try hard to navigate the trails without so much as a minor wheel-spin in an attempt to leave it as I found it. I too come across scores of trash and dumpsites. My wife suggested we mark waypoints and come back to clean a bunch of it up with the kids. We plan on doing our first such clean-up trip in the next couple weeks.

I think it's important for us to remember that, there will always be people whose outdoor interests do no align without ours, and as a result, they'll try to remove our ability to do what we enjoy. Even in the outdoor enthusiast communities, there has always been a land battle between the various hobbies. Hikers want foot traffic only, mountain bikers what hikers to relax and get out of the way, horseback riders want everyone to go away and stop spooking their horses, and none of them like "destructive and polluting" ORV's in the mix. I think the best we can do is set a good example for others, and become an ambassador of our "sport" so to speak.

 

[blackntan]

So I get up this morning and figured I would watch a video or two on Youtube before I started my day. I ran across a video with "Overland Bound" in the title and thought that would be a great video to watch. By the time I got a quarter of the way through the video I was so disgusted I had to force myself to finish watching it. I will be polite and not call people out but they either don't understand what "Leave No Trace" or "Tread Lightly" is, or don't care to follow it. The video showed a number of people driving in wet lands (and getting massively stuck) and blazing new trails. I was really surprised to see a number of vehicles parked in a lake just to get a cool picture (I am giving them the benefit of doubt that they were not washing the mud off their vehicles in the lake).

Most of the off-road organizations I have been involved in preach Tread Lightly because they don't want to risk losing access to public lands (which this video was taken on). I have always had a problem with these organizations because their understanding of these principles only seem to go as far as "don't screw it up for everyone" but in general don't seem to care about the principles.

I have always seen Overlanders as being different. Overlanders embrace the principles of Leave No Trace and Treadly Lightly because it is nature itself that is the attraction. I heard repeatedly to air down so you don't leave holes on the trail from spinning or create corrigation on the trail. Or there is the more widely discussed "Pack it in - Pack it out" as well as leave it better than you found it. I've always seen Overlanding as having a higher standard of conduct than off-roaders primarily because their purpose is appreciation of the land they are on. Has Overlanding gotten so popular that their standard of conduct has dropped, or are we getting people involved in the Overland community that just don't get what Overlanding is about?

I think the biggest principle the people in the video missed is "Leave it as you found it". To me what they did was no better than the kid who scribes his name in the middle of the 2,000 year old rock painting.

what if 2000 years ago the picture was drawn by a young kid inventing graffti art. JUST A THOUGHT

 

[OffroadTreks]

what if 2000 years ago the picture was drawn by a young kid inventing graffti art. JUST A THOUGHT

Cave art by primitive humans is a far cry from aerosol paint defacing a national monument when human civilization tops out at around 7.9 billion.

Also, this is garbage created by degenerates. There is no cultural or artistic significance.

 

[professorkx]

I don't think it's possible to leave no trace and enjoy public lands in a vehicle unless you plan on staying on paved roads and organized campgrounds. I agree with not abusing the area you are exploring, but the simple fact that we are there means we left a trace.

I don't believe we should just lock everyone out of public lands so no trace of humans is ever found, as that is a waste of the public lands...IMHO. So, I am more of the version of leaving as little trace as possible. Cleaning my camping area does not mean eliminating the tracks left on the ground left by my jeep. Abusing the land by trying to blast through every area with water is a whole different matter, but I have found those folks can't be reasoned with....

 

[The Traveling Shepherd]

I've come to realize some people are simply self centered pigs

 

[blackntan]

Cave art by primitive humans is a far cry from aerosol paint defacing a national monument when human civilization tops out at around 7.9 billion.

Also, this is garbage created by degenerates. There is no cultural or artistic significance.

My sence of humour seems to be misplaced Some times Iam afraid this planet will only benifit when mankind has left

 

[LostInSocal]

I don't think it's possible to leave no trace and enjoy public lands in a vehicle unless you plan on staying on paved roads and organized campgrounds. I agree with not abusing the area you are exploring, but the simple fact that we are there means we left a trace.

This! Time to take up backpacking.

 

[luchaDor]

My sence of humour seems to be misplaced Some times Iam afraid this planet will only benifit when mankind has left

Well, if you're post/humor was intended to be sarcastic, (which I see)...you'll want to put the '/s' at the end of it...then folks reading it know its meant as sarcasm. Kind of a way to add a 'tone' to a posting if you follow me. (Just trying to be helpful.)

 

[OffroadTreks]

I don't think it's possible to leave no trace and enjoy public lands in a vehicle unless you plan on staying on paved roads and organized campgrounds. I agree with not abusing the area you are exploring, but the simple fact that we are there means we left a trace.

I don't believe we should just lock everyone out of public lands so no trace of humans is ever found, as that is a waste of the public lands...IMHO. So, I am more of the version of leaving as little trace as possible. Cleaning my camping area does not mean eliminating the tracks left on the ground left by my jeep. Abusing the land by trying to blast through every area with water is a whole different matter, but I have found those folks can't be reasoned with....

It's really just guidelines for etiquette to do the least damage. And I agree, closure isn't management.

You're right though, we do leave our mark. But I think we can limit that to the trails and things that are established. Kind of why it's recommended you camp in established sites when out on BLM or NFS land. It reduces the impact to the same area.

Moab comes to mind a good example for me since I frequent it a lot.

There are hundreds of established trails in that area. Those trails change over time because humans are traveling over them regularly. It's important though, that people stay on the trail and don't widen the trail because some areas don't recover for a long time out there. Sometimes decades. And there was one instance where people started blazing a shortcut around an obstacle and that shortcut redirected water that used to flow one way, straight down the trail causing washout.

 

[blackntan]

Well, if you're post/humor was intended to be sarcastic, (which I see)...you'll want to put the '/s' at the end of it...then folks reading it know its meant as sarcasm. Kind of a way to add a 'tone' to a posting if you follow me. (Just trying to be helpful.)

Lol. If you had a sence of humour you would HAVE GOT IT Lol SARCASM IT WAS NOT ' ILL TREAD LIGHTLY FROM NOW ON '. Ps Humor dont need gramar were am from you either get it or you Dont.

 

[blackntan]

This! Time to take up backpacking.

. We call backpackers 'CRAGRATS '. (Humour alert )

 

[professorkx]

This! Time to take up backpacking.

Well, backpacking isn't an option for a lot of folks because of disabilities/illnesses, and gets less possible the older you get. For me, the key is to limit the evidence of my visit, but the reality is that it will never be zero.

Boldadventure wrote that it's recommended to camp in designated sites. While that is possible in more populated areas, especially those ares with little public ground like the eastern US, it's simply not always possible in the west with vast areas of unpopulated public lands. We can go for days without seeing another human, and the forest service/BLM don't spend money building campgrounds where few people go. We love them when we find the campgrounds, and are usually the only ones in the campground, but they are just few and far between, so we dispersion camp.

 

[blackntan]

Cave art by primitive humans is a far cry from aerosol paint defacing a national monument when human civilization tops out at around 7.9 billion.

Also, this is garbage created by degenerates. There is no cultural or artistic significance.

The work of CRAGRATUCUS two legged animal Known to be a seasonal vista usually in small groups Never stays long but likes to leave its mark, vary in age and size , predominantly Roams in daylight To be avoided as can get qiute angry aroud 4x4
Behavour Lots of arm waving and jestoring Beware the female of the species