Higher Fuel Prices And Overlanding

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TangoRomeo7688

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Well, in Germany that are regular prices for fuel.

We pay since years more than 1,50€ / litre. That is about 1,80$ / litre or about 8$ / gallon.

Sometimes, especially before vacation time or holidays the price for unleaded fuel goes up to 1,70-1,85€ 7 liter or 1,50€ / liter of diesel.

Cheers

Tobias
 

leeloo

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You don't seem to understand the cost of multi-tiered government regulation as a function of extraction cost, probably due to the fact you have been subjected to it for so long that economic Stockholm Syndrome has set in.

You also don't seem to understand the very most basic principles of supply and demand.

Yes, the USA is importing oil from what can at the minimum be described as adversarial foreign governments (the Russian government owns and directs the oil industry) entirely due to the policies and regulation imposed on the free market by an administration that in 7 months has done absolutely nothing that is good for America. Nothing.

We as a nation just spent 4 years and more than 30 million dollars on a politically motivated witch hunt attempting to prosecute a duly elected President for "Russian collusion" (that despite the best efforts of the most nefarious group of turds to ever soil the face of the planet, came up empty handed) only to have the very same group of turds now happily doing business with the same Russians directing massive amounts of money and global influence directly to them , including removing sanctions against the Nordstream pipeline that will further increase Russias stranglehold on the European energy market.
Multi-tiered government.. wow big word there but I am not scared. I lived in Belgium, Brussels region about 6 years. You have 3 governments. The federal one is the highest . Fun fact, Belgium beat the record of Irak as a country with no elected federal government, almost 2 years. Belgium did fine, apparently the lack of federal government was not a big deal.The sad thing was that in theory no govrment should be cheaper, yet the price at the pump was the same...
30 mil dolars.. wow. . What is that 30 mil 1 F16 +pilot training + maintenance over 10 years? They really held nothing back.
Mate I am from Europe, I really don't care about US politics. At least the internal US politics. I do follow what they do externally, in relation with Europe, Asia. I can tell you seem to be a little worried about Biden. Maybe this will help a bit.
Biden seems to follow the same direction as Trump, at least in relation with Europe, Asia and the Middle east. The difference is that he is not so loud and annoying, he is a bit more well mannered and diplomatic, but essentially he is saying and doing the same things as Trump, except kissing Kim's ass, and, in my opinion, this has little influence on the price of gas either way.
 
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bgenlvtex

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Multi-tiered government.. wow big word there but I am not scared. I lived in Belgium, Brussels region about 6 years. You have 3 governments. The federal one is the highest . Fun fact, Belgium beat the record of Irak as a country with no elected federal government, almost 2 years. Belgium did fine, apparently the lack of federal government was not a big deal.The sad thing was that in theory no govrment should be cheaper, yet the price at the pump was the same...
30 mil dolars.. wow. . What is that 30 mil 1 F16 +pilot training + maintenance over 10 years? They really held nothing back.
Mate I am from Europe, I really don't care about US politics. At least the internal US politics. I do follow what they do externally, in relation with Europe, Asia. I can tell you seem to be a little worried about Biden. Maybe this will help a bit.
Biden seems to follow the same direction as Trump, at least in relation with Europe, Asia and the Middle east. The difference is that he is not so loud and annoying, he is a bit more well mannered and diplomatic, but essentially he is saying and doing the same things as Trump, except kissing Kim's ass, and, in my opinion, this has little influence on the price of gas either way.
You missed the operative word there "mate", regulation.

I know you are from the EU which is why you are completely unaware of the circumstances here, and how they affected our transition from full energy independence.

This is why I said that you literally have no idea what you are talking about. Which you just said yourself.
 
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Tundracamper

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Biden seems to follow the same direction as Trump, at least in relation with Europe, Asia and the Middle east. The difference is that he is not so loud and annoying, he is a bit more well mannered and diplomatic, but essentially he is saying and doing the same things as Trump, except kissing Kim's ass, and, in my opinion, this has little influence on the price of gas either way.
That may be the most naive thing I’ve read this year. That’s like saying salt and sodium are the same.
 

Scarab

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I have gleaned a little something from this thread......
I'm beginning to notice a distinct difference between the way N. Americans and Europeans participate in this thread....
It's a point that's interested me for a while. Other than the jealousy of "why do they get cheaper fuel than us!"

For most of the countries in Europe fuel taxation has been a thing since the inception of the common use motor vehicle. The fuel taxation act of 1910 here in the UK replaced the way it was taxed before, as prior to this most motor vehicles were commercially owned the revenue was raised from commercial taxes.
When the private individuals started to take up buying motor cars at such a rate that it put a strain on supplies of fuel oils the government in the UK followed those in other near countries and taxed it. There was also the huge infrastructure that was needed to support this which was invested in early on.

The USA, from what I can find in a bit of research, didn't bring in fuel taxation until over 20 years later and the widespread use of the motor car by the public was much more advanced. The reduced competition from neighbouring countries and the fact the US has always heavily subsidised oil exploration means it's kept cheaper.

The main reason behind the mentality of it though is that in Europe it's been taxed since day 1 people started owning motor cars so it's been accepted as part and parcel of ownership. In the US they didn't try and tax it until too late in the adoption of ownership so it's never been able to be accelerated at the level of some other countries.

Of course those in countries like Venezuela and Bolivia where the governments actively subsidise the cost of fuel at the pump and pay $0.25 a gallon (US) would argue that fuel is expensive everywhere.


As a personal point I think that those in countries like Denmark, Germany etc where fuel is highly taxed at least get the benefit of well maintained road networks and well funded road service teams.
Here in the UK we get a totally bum deal, massively high fuel costs and the road network is a shambles. There's potholes on some of the "main" roads around here that are inches deep and pop tyres and shatter rims on a regular basis but they never get repaired properly, just filled and then they sink again a few months later.

I have, out of necessity, had to accept the high fuel costs though and it does limit where and when we can go away. Even with an efficient diesel engine doing a 600 mile round trip is easily costs me $300+ in diesel.

Thanks for the informed and passionate debate though. Very much enjoy seeing perspectives from all round the world.
Alex
 
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Arailt

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My Lexus gets roughly 12 MPG thanks to my tires and lead foot. The dollar+ increase since this time last year has definitely ballooned my fill-ups.

That said, rising gas prices have not negatively affected my daily wheeling trips to the Starbucks drive-thru.
 

Jim SoG

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Stay off politics and on OP subject/Question.

Not saying it again.

Jim
 

keith.gowan

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I'm out in SoCal. With the wife and I working from home, we aren't commuting. So, regardless of the price at the pump, we are still off-roading as we normally do. She's in a 2020 Wrangler, and I'm in a 100 Series LandCruiser. Neither are economy vehicles in any situation. That said, we just see it as the price of admission for our hobby.
 

Alanymarce

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It might be good, but it does not exist in Europe. There are some 20 year old ones. very capable. I am talking exclusively about new vehicles that you can buy easy. Large pickups.. No they do not exist in Europe and there is a reason for it, there is no need. In Europe, there are only what you would call mid size pick ups in US( Ford ranger size ) , but with a twist, most likely due to regulations. They have almost double the payload and towing capacity compared to a similar sized pick up in US. IF you need more payload/ towing you can buy big vans or small trucks but most are useless off road. Anyway, my problem is solved, I will get delivery of a new Defender P300 next week, petrol engine, no adblue no other crap, good enough off road and sufficient payload. Exactly what I looking for. And to my surprise, at least during the drive test I got a similar fuel economy with from a 300 HP petrol engine with my 150 HP diesel on Hilux....
You'r right of course, in terms of new vehicle availabilty, however Shoguns were sold until last year in some parts of Europe, so there are some very good ones around. If it has to be a new vehicle then there are none. We travelled in two countries in Europe last month and Pajeros/Shoguns were very visible.
 

SteveC-Pro4X

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In March 2021 I began a 5 month trek from Pennsylvania to Texas/Arizona/Utah/Wyoming - most of my time was in these four states. The fuel prices rose steadily during the trek. Not much a person can do when you're thousands of miles from home. Grin and bear it.

The rising fuel prices did not diminish the treks awe and splendor. Photo is from KOFA in southwestern AZ.
 

Alanymarce

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Just for reference:

“Big trips” - on average, once every 3 years for 10 months. On the last “big trip” we spent AUD 12,180.00 (= USD 8190.00) to cover around 45,000 km - so about USD 18/100 km. If fuel price had doubled half way through the trip we would have changed nothing - the value of the journey is worth it. Fuel price is what it is, we weren't going to say “Oh well, with the fuel price in Australia we’re not going to go”.

Current fuel price in Australia is USD 1.05/L

Shorter trips - on our last "shorter trip” we spent ISK 104,000 (= USD 823) on fuel to cover 5900 Km, so about USD14/100 km. This was using a rental vehicle (we were only a month in the country and shipping charges for our own vehicle would have been USD 20,000 or so for a month’s trip obviously out of the question). The rented vehicle was a lot more frugal on fuel than our own. Had we shipped our own vehicle, or rented the same model (at more than twice the rental price), we’d have spent around USD 34/100 km, so about twice as much as in Australia. Once again, our interest in exploring Iceland was far more important than the high cost of fuel.

Current fuel price in Iceland is USD1.95/L

Travelling at home - we don’t use the vehicle at home much - mostly weekend trips or a couple of weeks once in a while. We last bought fuel for own vehicle on June 19th (3 months ago) and still have half a tank. Fuel here is relatively inexpensive, and we spend about USD 11/100 Km. So, if we were concerned only about fuel price we would stay at home, since most other places have higher fuel costs, however it’s far more attractive to explore the world. We do get out for anything from a day to a month at home when we can, but fuel cost has nothing to do with frequency or distance.

Current fuel price in Colombia is USD 0.60/L

Simpson camp 1 small.jpg
IMG_3934.JPG01 Montero in Chingaza test run.jpg
 

socal66

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I have to laugh when I think about overlanding gas prices from a trip a few years ago to Iceland. I rented this 4wd camper for a couple of weeks and it really didn't hit me until my first fill up at around $400. Gas prices there were the equivalent of over $11 gallon and I was averaging single digit MPG.

P6210135.JPG
 

Murphy Slaw

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In March 2021 I began a 5 month trek from Pennsylvania to Texas/Arizona/Utah/Wyoming - most of my time was in these four states. The fuel prices rose steadily during the trek. Not much a person can do when you're thousands of miles from home. Grin and bear it.

The rising fuel prices did not diminish the treks awe and splendor. Photo is from KOFA in southwestern AZ.
Man that reminds me of growing up in Apache Jct.

We used to ride dirtbikes and look for the Lost Dutchman Mine...
 
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Seventhstream

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Hybrids do well with city driving - they are able to recapture energy otherwise lost to the brakes. Everything else is a compromise to that end. I can't see it working well for overlanding.
Lets remember that it is the "Overland" that caught our interest, not the vehicle that got you there. Electric or Gas, all should be a go!
 
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