Help me pick a truck.

[Dilldog]

Dodge doesn’t hold up... I disagree...400,000 miles on old blue, she’s a gas 3/4 ton btw, 300,000 have been put on by me. I did everything with her from DD to towing logging equipment to use her as a service truck loaded down with tools, to Overlanding, and most recently as a mud racing truck... only issues I have had was needing a new water pump at 200,000 miles which led me to replace the radiator, timing set, the thermostat, and all the hoses since I was already in there. Then I spun a rod bearing Racing last fall. So now she sits waiting on a replacement engine.
So exactly why is Dodge 3/4 ton a bad choice?

I'm just going off of what I have seen at work. People who use pickups to haul a lot of weight over rough terrain everyday don't have good luck with Dodges. Every farmer I know will say the only reason they run Dodge is for the Cummins and the rest of the pickup is less than great. My old 93 was great because of the Cummins but it always had something going wrong. But it seems like all the Superduties I see just take the punishment and keep going.

 

[M Rose]

I'm just going off of what I have seen at work. People who use pickups to haul a lot of weight over rough terrain everyday don't have good luck with Dodges. Every farmer I know will say the only reason they run Dodge is for the Cummins and the rest of the pickup is less than great. My old 93 was great because of the Cummins but it always had something going wrong. But it seems like all the Superduties I see just take the punishment and keep going.

Funny how there really isn’t much difference in terain between you and I, but here most of the Farmers and Ranchers run Dodge because Ford and Chevy Sean to shake apart more. And I have seen this firsthand myself... although before the second generation of Ram, they all used GMC ... I don’t know if the farmers here have stuck with Dodge due to the Cummins Name and the poor name of the Ford 6.0 puker stoke, or because Dodge just plain works... I do know that a Ford Loyalist Rancher recently (2019) traded in all of his Fords for Dodges do to bodies falling off the frames... time will tell if his Rams will hold up to the abuse he puts his rigs through. (This said rancher beats his trucks harder than any one I have ever seen.)

 

[Ralph]

I see this must be a pick-up vehicle...
Still I read your plan = will be living 100% time in it. Well - pick up truck may be good base to habitat overlander - but You'll never cover this plan with 20gr$

In my opinion You may see around good american van with 4x4 - just lift it, put a bed inside and go.
2 option - buy yourself 90' truck cheapest possible and spend the rest for off-road trailor. That live in it.

Have U followed YT - Chris from orange JEEP - he has had the plan of Yours - check out how it works after few years...

 

[Dilldog]

Funny how there really isn’t much difference in terain between you and I, but here most of the Farmers and Ranchers run Dodge because Ford and Chevy Sean to shake apart more. And I have seen this firsthand myself... although before the second generation of Ram, they all used GMC ... I don’t know if the farmers here have stuck with Dodge due to the Cummins Name and the poor name of the Ford 6.0 puker stoke, or because Dodge just plain works... I do know that a Ford Loyalist Rancher recently (2019) traded in all of his Fords for Dodges do to bodies falling off the frames... time will tell if his Rams will hold up to the abuse he puts his rigs through. (This said rancher beats his trucks harder than any one I have ever seen.)

I will agree with the GM comment, I really only see them with small time auto transport, wich makes sense because they are a great riding and handling pickup. Like I said above the customer of ours that really hammers their trucks building cell towers just got 2 GMCs, ill be very interested to see how they hold up. As for the PSD comments I agree. The 6.0L really tanked the reputation, I have worked on a few and Im not impressed. I will say from my first hand experience where Dodges fall short is the front end. Ball joints, tie rod ends, track bar ends, drag link ends, and wheel bearings wear out faster than Ford under hard use, about twice as fast actually.
All this is not to say I think Dodge is crap, I put my 93 through a lot and a good friend of mine put his 95 through a lot. Just off of what I have experienced and seen and heard I dont believe them to be the best choice for hard back country use.

 

[Billiebob]

So durability/reliability.... solid axle not IFS.
Economy, keep it stock, no lift keep the stock rubber.
Cosmetics, shop in rust free states like Arizona, Nevada.
500# - 700# plus a "smooth" ride, likely a 1/2 ton. But if you go heavier get a 3/4 ton.
Performance, since you list economy and reliability get the base powertrain. Adding power seldom increases economy or reliability. But there will be lots of response to how wrong I am. You decide.

40mph - 60mph on gravel, pot holes, washboard, you need stock tires. Bigger heavier tires will just be rougher riding and slow you down, not to mention the hit on gas mileage.

Solid axles cancel all GMs, Leaving either Ford Super Duty or Dodge.

 

[bgenlvtex]

guess i'll be the devil and say IFS trucks are as good as a SA

40-60 mph on gravel, pot holed, washboard road will get you skittering sideways with a solid axle. this is where IFS shines.
i own both a GM SA truck and a GM IFS truck, both are wheeled constantly, and both are extremley durable. i have always owned SA trucks till we bought the '90 stepper for my wife 25 yrs ago. as i was not a fan of Inferior Front Suspensions, i figured it would be good enough for wife to get off our un-plowed street in the winter. she drove it (mildly) for 9 yrs till i took it over. i drove it easy for a yr or so cause i bought into that "ifs is weaker" notion too. then i said the hay with it...
my stepper now has 16 yrs under me and around 300 thou miles with about 50-60% off road, 'bout 20% of that past "normal" wheeling and into "abuse" territory. in 25 yrs of ownership i have only replaced the tie rod ends once, and each CV once, nothing else.
i cranked the fr bars a little over an inch and put add a leaves in the rear just so i could get some decent size tires on it (285/70R16)- still have never had a prob.
ride? IFS all the way, SA does not compare, whether leaf, or coil
toughness? SA, but don't count out a IFS, the fastest trucks in off road racing (trophy trucks) all use IFS, many pullers are also IFS and look at the guys drag racing IFS trucks- launch in 4 and then shift into 2. over a 1000 lbs of torque to the IFS with no breakage, there's a shock load.
i still prefer my SA (simpler and cheaper) but don't count out an IFS truck, whatever brand you buy. it will do pretty much what most people will throw at it with no drama. and it would be hard (impossible) to get 34" of travel out of a front SA.
funny, people love the IFS in the Raptor, but look down on all other makers IFS

I see this IFS argument with some regularity "Dem race truck though!"

Completely invalid point with regards to daily drivers.

OP has a 20K budget, meaning he cannot afford to replace entire suspensions on the regular. Racing vehicles of any type are composed entirely of consumables, suspensions, drive lines, engines, bodies. The only thing not considered consumable is the driver, and some times they miss the mark there.

Durability and reliability over long term, particularly on a budget nothing beats SFA. Coil springs extend the life of that SFA.

 

[MidOH]

Our rigs get a bit of off road use. I can confirm that the Ford axles are king, but the solid axle Ram is only marginally less so.

I'd go Ford Super Duty first, Dodge HD 2500+ second. Toyota, Nissan, 3rd. I'd avoid GM at all cost.

Good engines from Ford: 4.6, 5.0, 6.8, maybe 5.4 if it's a 2v, 6.2l, 7.3l, and 6.7l.
Good Ram engines: Any Cummins.

Budget a trans rebuild if you get a 4r100 Ford trans, or any used Ram trans.

 

[JCWages]

I'm trying to imagine flying through the desert at high speeds in an old 3/4 ton truck.......

 

[bcfre]

Our rigs get a bit of off road use. I can confirm that the Ford axles are king, but the solid axle Ram is only marginally less so.

I'd go Ford Super Duty first, Dodge HD 2500+ second. Toyota, Nissan, 3rd. I'd avoid GM at all cost.

Good engines from Ford: 4.6, 5.0, 6.8, maybe 5.4 if it's a 2v, 6.2l, 7.3l, and 6.7l.
Good Ram engines: Any Cummins.

Budget a trans rebuild if you get a 4r100 Ford trans, or any used Ram trans.

What is the max $ amount you'd pay for 2012-2015 Super Duty F250 6.2L 4x4? How about older Ram 2500? They seem more available.

Edit: in the 50-100k mileage range.

 

[MidOH]

$15 000ish. It 's better to buy new.

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[MidOH]

I'm trying to imagine flying through the desert at high speeds in an old 3/4 ton truck.......

It's done every day. Choose your pace, and sign a check:

 

[Defender 90 Keith]

How about that blue one over there?

 

[MidOH]

I'd never replace a 50 with a 14b. Coil spring D60 Ford conversions are very popular for the old leaf spring Fords. And quite easy.

I don't think the OP is interested in trucks that old. 05+ Fords are all D60 fronts, IME.

 

[MidOH]

Jebbez no. Replacing the 10.5 is a waste of time and money. There's nothing wrong with them. Around here the SD axles are one of the most prized junkyard finds for truggies and such.

Ford D60 bible:

info on Ford Super Duty Dana 60 axle

www.pirate4x4.com

And we have to shave the 14b's which is a major pita. They're just big fat pigs on anything less than 38" tires.

Where I stand on IFS vs. solid axles, comes down to 10 000# trucks with campers. IFS doesn't survive that well over here when loaded. It's easier to make a solid axle ride well on rough roads for ''overlanding'', than it is to make IFS stronger and locker friendly. The Carli promo vid is obviously a bit more extreme than what we need over here.

Not to mention that OEM IFS is pretty darn crappy. If we gut it all, it can ride well, and be durable, but I'd rather not spend $8000 on my front end.

 

[bcfre]

Thanks again for all of the input so far, amazing welcome I've gotten here.

I think I've decided that I want a 1st gen 05-06 Access Cab Tundra. The hunt for one of these things in decent condition is real though. Luckily I'm not really limited by distance when it comes to shopping.

Anyone have any experience with or feedback on an 05-06 Tundra?

$15 000ish. It 's better to buy new.

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Unfortunately new is not an option for me, can't find any new 4x4 for less than $30-35k. Found an amazing loaded 2016 Silverado for 23k with some minor body damage and it sold an hour before I got to it.

 

[tjZ06]

Like I said above Dodge trucks simply don't hold up to hard use, especially the new ones. Also Dodge front axles use thinner wall tubes than Fords. Also the front wheel bearings on Superduties have a fail safe that the Dodge unit bearing does not. If that bearing fails your wheel is coming off in the Dodge, where as with the Ford the wheel will stay on the spindle allowing you to stop safely. Also I have seen Dodge 4500s with 50k on the clock where ball joints, tie rods, track bar, and wheel bearings are all shot. Typically I won't see that level of wear in a Ford 450 or 550 until 90k. Straight up Dodges don't hold up to hard use, that's why you see Superduties on most job sites. only reason to go with Dodge in my opinion is for that sweet coil sprung rear suspension. One of the guys I work with has that set up and it's amazing off road, and rides very well.

Do you have any actual data, like wall thickness specs to back up some of your claims?

I agree, both RAM (or Dodge, if old enough) and Ford solid axle trucks actually have a lot of front end part wear. It's funny, the RAM and Ford guys like to make fun of the IFS GM trucks for "weak front ends" yet the RAM and Ford guys are constantly changing front end parts. The bottom line is if you actually use a 3/4-1 ton truck offroad, things will wear out. If it's an IFS GM it'll probably be wheel unit bearings and tie-rod ends, perhaps ball joints. Well, truth be told it's all the same parts on all of them (unit bearings, tie rods, ball joints) solid axle or IFS.

I don't think AEV would use RAM trucks for their Prospector XLs if they were nearly as frail as you describe.

-TJ

 

[tjZ06]

IFS doesn't survive that well

I always find these kind of generalizations silly.


These things deal with pretty rough terrain... and are IFS/IRS and seem to do okay.

Not to mention that OEM IFS is pretty darn crappy.

Oh, is it? Whats your problem with the '11+ GM 3/4-1 ton IFS? No, I wouldn't pick it to build a rock crawler or race baja... but it turns out that's not what I do with my 3/4 ton truck anyway. I tow heavy and put a mix of freeway and dirt miles on the truck, but it's not a 'hardcore'... well hardcore anything. I don't expect it to run washes at 80 MPH or conquer Fordyce.

-TJ

 

[MidOH]

I can't stop staring at that 'lil tie rod in that pic. Lol.

Do what you want. But IME, the GM 2500 front end is just terrible. Doesn't seem to offer any more travel, doesn't flex that much, and rides as bad as the Ram and Ford. Whatever it's supposed to improve.......

 

[tjZ06]

I can't stop staring at that 'lil tie rod in that pic. Lol.

Do what you want. But IME, the GM 2500 front end is just terrible. Doesn't seem to offer any more travel, doesn't flex that much, and rides as bad as the Ram and Ford. Whatever it's supposed to improve.......

I sense a LOT of bias in your estimation of the GM 2500 front end... but that's fine, we're all humans and we'd be lying if we said our biases and preferences didn't factor in our decision making process. As for what is improved on the '11+ vs. '01-10 platform: basically everything. All of the components are bigger, including things like tie-rods (the stock '11+ tie rod ends look like aftermarket tie rod ends for a '01-10), the hubs themselves (much larger unit bearings, necessitating the move to 8 on 180mm lug pattern), the brakes, etc. etc. etc.

Before getting into Overlanding I was (and still am) into sand duning. Sand duning means getting a trailer into sand dunes. Places like Glamis do have some paved options, but places like Pismo mean pulling 15k+ trailers through soft sand with varied terrain. I have friends with every brand and type of HD diesel trucks. They all have ups and downs, but everyone universally agrees my truck rides better and has better "road manners" than the RAM and Fords. We've all had to replace this and that, but again I expect that with a 8k lbs+ truck towing a 16k lbs trailer offroad and 117k miles total on the clock.

I also have a family cabin that's ~4hrs out a washboard, dirt/rock fireroad. I've even gone "Overlanding" with my '11. It rides way better in those conditions than my buddies' solid axle trucks. But I'd rather have their solid axle trucks when it gets truly technical and rocky. If I was looking for larger than my 35"s I'd also want the stick-axles, as I hate the erector set look of big lift IFS trucks.

My point is, they all have ups and downs, some downs are show-stoppers for me (like any 6.0 or 6.4 PSD) and others you live with (like GM putting square fender openings on their trucks for round wheels...).

 

[MMc]

Some of you guys are way down a rabbit hole! I would rather go do something than discuss the finer points of Axels and front ends.
WOW!