Chevy vs Ford vs Toyota pickup

[Renaissance_Man]

FYI: I think this is the 4th thread I started trying to help me decide on the best rig for me - with the help of this community I'm almost at a decision.

I originally liked Toyota because one user drove his tundra for 1 million miles over 8 years and because a Toyota towed a space shuttle. I've finally decided that while these are incredible they're isolated incidents - the guy took really good care of his truck & any pickup can tow a shuttle if allowed to go slow enough. My last thought on Toyota is that even if they are the most reliable it's at the expense of innovation & convenience; innovation in the motor & tailgate & convenience in the bed tie down points & the interior.

So I went to a Chevy dealership today to ask among other questions today, "What makes Chevy pickups special?".

He answered me that he can't put down Ford & every manufacturer has their advantages & disadvantages. I'm very disappointed with his answer.

Please tell me how you disagree with my assessment on Toyota & any differences that you notice between Ford & Chevrolet

Happy trails,
Nicholas

 

[MidOH]

Taco's are still super reliable if you keep them on the street. But the archaic transmission and Camry engine need to go away. It's time for a new Taco. With head room this time. The Taco is the only truck you mentioned with a warranty. Dont expect Ford or GM to honor much of anything. Toyotas reliability, combined with the cache from the gen2's, is why they're still super popular. If you look objectively at only the truck, it's obsolete.

The Ranger is fine as long as you scrap the shocks immediately. Put some Fox 2.0's on. Or go big and budget for Fox or King 2.5's. So far the Ranger has been spared from Fords freaky warranty issues. People wanted a Hilux copy, they got it. Beware, some dealers are better than others. I avoid urban Ford dealers like the plague (except in FL). I found a little country Ford dealer that has one good tech I trust. Most Ford dealers can't service an F350 or larger, because they're morons.

GM's are simply low quality. Lowest of all car brands. They come out with a nice design from time to time, like the zr2. But their execution is lacking. He was just trying to be honest. That doesn't mean they should be cut from your list, just know what you're getting into.

I haven't tried the Nissan yet. The old little Titan was awesome until the xfer case failed. Working on Nissans is like a puzzle. You need to remove 787 pieces to access one simple item. Ford copied this for the Rangers damn oil filter.

I'd go Ranger for now, it seems that they have learned from their global trucks. Then Zr2 if they weren't so expensive.

The Gladiator should be in this discussion, but it's still expensive as well. And only looks good on 37" tires. OEM's are remarkably ugly. Where's the hemi? Where's my manual transmission? It's still a Jeep with no engine, until someone proves the diesel.

 

[MMc]

I have a friend that owns a company that services the AK oil pipeline, his trucks run up and down service roads in all weather, the roads are dirt and gravel at best, plenty of washboard. He use mostly 3/4 ton fords and dodges. He would love to use smaller trucks, but for him it is cheaper to run a 3/4 ton for 6 to 8 years, instead of 4 years for a 1/2 or smaller. He says the smaller trucks just don't last. He is trying the Dodge 2500's now, he runs mostly Ford partly because of price and parts. These are work trucks that are drive by employee's that don't always care mush about the truck.
I have converted to full size trucks for me the 3/4 gas has worked the best for me. I don't wheel hard and don't plan to, crappy dirt road is about all I do. I try to stay away from rocks bigger than a basket balls.

 

[Renaissance_Man]

Taco's are still super reliable if you keep them on the street. But the archathe transmission and Camry engine need to go away. It's time for a new Taco. With head room this time. The Taco is the only truck you mentioned with a warranty. Dont expect Ford or GM to honor much of anything. Toyotas reliability, combined with the cache from the gen2's, is why they're still super popular. If you look objectively at only the truck, it's obsolete.

The Ranger is fine as long as you scrap the shocks immediately. Put some Fox 2.0's on. Or go big and budget for Fox or King 2.5's. So far the Ranger has been spared from Fords freaky warranty issues. People wanted a Hilux copy, they got it. Beware, some dealers are better than others. I avoid urban Ford dealers like the plague (except in FL). I found a little country Ford dealer that has one good tech I trust. Most Ford dealers can't service an F350 or larger, because they're morons.

GM's are simply low quality. Lowest of all car brands. They come out with a nice design from time to time, like the zr2. But their execution is lacking. He was just trying to be honest. That doesn't mean they should be cut from your list, just know what you're getting into.

I haven't tried the Nissan yet. The old little Titan was awesome until the xfer case failed. Working on Nissans is like a puzzle. You need to remove 787 pieces to access one simple item. Ford copied this for the Rangers damn oil filter.

I'd go Ranger for now, it seems that they have learned from their global trucks. Then Zr2 if they weren't so expensive.

The Gladiator should be in this discussion, but it's still expensive as well. And only looks good on 37" tires. OEM's are remarkably ugly. Where's the hemi? Where's my manual transmission? It's still a Jeep with no engine, until someone proves the diesel.

I neglected to mention that I realized that my only reason for considering mid size trucks isn't practical - I wanted a go anywhere rig that's narrow enough to go on ATV trails, but a mid size still can't go on them for multiple reasons. I don't think I ever need to tow anything (just me & my wife & we sleep in hammocks) so I'm considering full size pickups.

I heard that a makes require removing bid piece to change a simple part; it's only the big piece & simple part that change between makes. Please correct this statement if you disagree.

Are Hemis good for anything besides racing? I choose off road ability over speed any day.

Gladiators aren't in the list because the seats are too low to the floor

 

[Renaissance_Man]

Preface: I'm a motorhead from the muscle care era.

When all else appears to be equal then compare: 1) cost of repairs and parts, 2) ease of repairs and obtaining parts, 3) and aftermarket support.

Nothing more frustrating than repair cost being high and difficult, parts hard to get, and the aftermarket industry having little or no interest.

Hope this post helps a little :-)

It helps a lot thanks

 

[MidOH]

None of the Jeep engines seem reliable. Some are saying that the Ram Hemi engine has been fixed, and is reliable now.

I can get an entire XJ for the cost of just some upgrades to the average mid sized overlander. If I want to do Utah again, I'll just tow a flatbed car hauler, and an olde banged up cheapo XJ or TJU, out there.

See that's the catch to those small tight trails, some are easy, some aren't. And if you break down, you're screwed if you have to be home in 2 weeks. So if I overland, I'm sticking to easy stuff, which is where a fullsize rules. You really have to plan out exactly where youre going. Some areas a fullsize just plain doesn't fit. And some of those areas still have tight easy trails. A trail maintained by a Jeep club, is going to nearly always tailored to Jeeps.

The TAT is as hardcore as I'll get for at least the next ten years. Fullsize fits fine. Midsize Ranger pic from Ranger Station.com:

might be a good read for you:

Trans America Trail - The Ranger Station

I became aware of the Trans America Trail back around 2014/2015, and it became a bucket list adventure that I wanted to complete. Sam Correro followed his passion for adventure and set out with a goal to chart an epic … Continued

www.therangerstation.com

If we did get our dander up for a Utah trip right now, I'd haul my Suzuki DRZ400s to a basecamp.

 

[smlobx]

“None of the Jeep engines seem reliable”???

Really? The 3.6 found in the Gladiator and Wranglers has been used by FCA in about 1,000,000 vehicles over the past 10 years or so. I would say it is one of the most dependable engines out there in the mid size segment. It doesn’t make the most horsepower but it is very dependable. Mating it to the 8 speed ZF transmission makes this a great combination.

 

[DevilDodge]

I wish I could offer some advice...but not sure what is a Chevy, ford or Toyota...lol.

Now Dodge or RAM...they are what work for me. I have 3. All 2500s and they work great for what I use them for. They are all stock and have been all over the wilds of Pennsylvania

2 HEMI engines and a V10 Magnum

 

[loper]

For me, it's 3/4 or 1 ton Fords all the way. Had a 1/2 ton Ford and it was a maintenance hog.
Had a Dodge Ramcharger (essentially a 1/2 ton Dodge) that I really enjoyed, but not enough power (318) and again maintenance hog.
Driven several Chevys as work trucks, but never really liked them enough to spend my own money on one.
My wife had a '89 or 90 Toyota pickup when we met and it was bullet proof. Just wasn't big enough for the jobs we got into.
I had a '87 Jeep Comanche pickup (new in '87) that was bullet proof, agile, and fairly quick. Wasn't big enough for some of the things I wanted to do.

Currently I have a 3/4 ton Ford pickup and a 1 ton Ford van, happy with both of them.

Look at what you want to do and examine the capacities of the vehicles you are choosing from. Consider maintenance costs (diesels get expensive if you take them to the shop). I suggest getting a little more truck than you think you need, just so you're not right at the limit all the time.

All that being said, Toyotas are bullet proof if their capabilities meet your needs.

 

[DevilDodge]

WOW! 2 tons. What do you haul with those brutes?

View attachment 210347

 

[North American Sojourner]

I'm a ASE C1/P2/A4 guy. I've worked as a service tech for Ford and Kia. The bottom line on my thoughts are in the parts arena.
I've sold more parts for Dodge/Ram than any other vehicle
Chevy is second especially with wheel bearings. You can't hang 125lbs on a 1/2" hunk of metal..LOL
Ford is probably the best on parts. Motorcraft makes good shit. Really. (yeah I own one LOL)
Toyota leads the way with very few parts sold. Especially suspension and steering. Electrical parts are really good too.
If Subaru sold a truck, go buy 3 of them. It would be the last vehicle you owned....LOL.......(yes I own one of those too)
Real world experience but every vehicle will have their individual issues at one time or another. Some parts are just junk, including some from Mercedes...but not many..lol
Have a great day
Zim

 

[MidOH]

“None of the Jeep engines seem reliable”???

Really? The 3.6 found in the Gladiator and Wranglers has been used by FCA in about 1,000,000 vehicles over the past 10 years or so. I would say it is one of the most dependable engines out there in the mid size segment. It doesn’t make the most horsepower but it is very dependable. Mating it to the 8 speed ZF transmission makes this a great combination.

Well, good luck. My neighbor is on his 2nd Gladiator already.

900,000 cam shafts sold. I'll give them a free pass, for the heads, cooling system, and oil pump failures. Those are freaky, and I don't see a real design flaw there yet. But the rockers and cams are completely inexcusable. I rarely recommend extended warranties........

 

[smritte]

You didn't say if you were buying new or have the skill to build something old. Anyone you ask is going to give you an opinion based on what they have experienced or what they have been told. Myself, I have built a number of Jeeps, Toyota's, and Chevrolets for off road over the last 40 odd years. These vehicles were either raced or were toys. Everything will have its flaws. It all depends on what your willing to live with in the way of flaws.

Here's my opinion
I have built 6 Jeeps in the last 30 years and will never own or build another Jeep (Jeep looking rock buggy's don't count). The flaws in their engineering are getting better but still too high.

Ford has had too many failures in engineering up till now. I will never own a Ford for these reasons also but, they finally did something almost flawless in the truck with Eco Boost. I have been watching those since they came out and am impressed. I have off roaded with several and the only thing bad I can say is the physical size.

GM. If your building custom, there's a reason why the LS motors are in most toys. I have a 2014 Camaro and friends with high mileage Colorado's. So far, those are well put together.

I wont own a Dodge for more of the same reasons. Starting in the 80's what has happened to them is all based on who is in charge at the time. Their internal politics are why the brand is so flawed. Think polish, shine and heavy on advertising. I have several friends who have worked for them over the years as well as had to diagnose more weird electrical issues than any other brand. If you get a flawless vehicle, consider it a unicorn. I know their out there.

Toyota's, I own two. One could say I went full circle. 2019 Tacoma and 96 Cruiser. I really wish the Taco had more room but I needed another PU after I sold my Dually (tow rig for my toys) and the lack of interior room isn't an issue for me. I sold off the last of my Jeeps and started over again with a Cruiser.
The Cruiser is exactly what I need in the way of room, size and build. I also have a few years of building and a ton of money making it perfect for me.

If you want something big in a truck get an F-150, small Tacoma. SUV would be a Toyota. Which one would depend on what year, money and your skills. Thier brutally expensive.

Anything used will need to be base lined. That in itself can be daunting. I'm about 15k into moding and base lining my Cruiser with the transmission being the last thing to do. I didn't just rebuild the drive line but upholstery, most of the interior, weather striping, relays, connectors..... After the trans I will be about 20k total including buying it. Not bad for something that cost almost 50k in 96. If I couldn't do the work myself, that would double the amount spent.

Again, what you buy will depend on your skill and needs. If overlanding is fairly new to you, buy something used, moderate mileage, already built, drive it for a year and make sure this is for you.
Right now, there's a ton of built vehicles out there for sale, most of them were people who jumped onto the overlanding fad just to find out they didn't like it. Most of these people are trying to get all their money back. I'm seeing rigs that people paid to have built selling for (or trying to sell) for as much as 70k with very low mileage.
I'm also seeing well priced used vehicles in the 10k-15k range with around 100k miles.

 

[MazeVX]

So, throwing my money in...
Like with almost everything as long as you compare apples with apples it's a give and take with current production models.
The ford's aren't selling as good as they do for no reason, so there must be something good.
Personally I like chevy or gmc more than ford and the ram trucks all seemed to be a bit more harsh riding than Ford or chevy.
Never go for the highest trim or the biggest or smallest engine. Putting down many miles or lots of equipment in the back permanently? 250/2500
Mostly empty, normal driving? 150/1500

Tow and haul like a boss? 350/3500
Tow and haul like famous youtubers? 450/4500 or bigger ;-)

 

[MMc]

WOW! 2 tons. What do you haul with those brutes?

View attachment 210347

I would saw just about anything he wants.

 

[Renaissance_Man]

None of the Jeep engines seem reliable. Some are saying that the Ram Hemi engine has been fixed, and is reliable now.

I can get an entire XJ for the cost of just some upgrades to the average mid sized overlander. If I want to do Utah again, I'll just tow a flatbed car hauler, and an olde banged up cheapo XJ or TJU, out there.

See that's the catch to those small tight trails, some are easy, some aren't. And if you break down, you're screwed if you have to be home in 2 weeks. So if I overland, I'm sticking to easy stuff, which is where a fullsize rules. You really have to plan out exactly where youre going. Some areas a fullsize just plain doesn't fit. And some of those areas still have tight easy trails. A trail maintained by a Jeep club, is going to nearly always tailored to Jeeps.

The TAT is as hardcore as I'll get for at least the next ten years. Fullsize fits fine. Midsize Ranger pic from Ranger Station.com:

might be a good read for you:

Trans America Trail - The Ranger Station

I became aware of the Trans America Trail back around 2014/2015, and it became a bucket list adventure that I wanted to complete. Sam Correro followed his passion for adventure and set out with a goal to chart an epic … Continued

www.therangerstation.com

If we did get our dander up for a Utah trip right now, I'd haul my Suzuki DRZ400s to a basecamp.

I was very interested in the ranger but then I found out that it's not allowed on most ATV trails because mid size trucks are a little too wide (at the wheelbase) & these are usually privately owned trails. So I'm now considering full size trucks

 

[Renaissance_Man]

Taco's are still super reliable if you keep them on the street. But the archaic transmission and Camry engine need to go away. It's time for a new Taco. With head room this time. The Taco is the only truck you mentioned with a warranty. Dont expect Ford or GM to honor much of anything. Toyotas reliability, combined with the cache from the gen2's, is why they're still super popular. If you look objectively at only the truck, it's obsolete.

The Ranger is fine as long as you scrap the shocks immediately. Put some Fox 2.0's on. Or go big and budget for Fox or King 2.5's. So far the Ranger has been spared from Fords freaky warranty issues. People wanted a Hilux copy, they got it. Beware, some dealers are better than others. I avoid urban Ford dealers like the plague (except in FL). I found a little country Ford dealer that has one good tech I trust. Most Ford dealers can't service an F350 or larger, because they're morons.

GM's are simply low quality. Lowest of all car brands. They come out with a nice design from time to time, like the zr2. But their execution is lacking. He was just trying to be honest. That doesn't mean they should be cut from your list, just know what you're getting into.

I haven't tried the Nissan yet. The old little Titan was awesome until the xfer case failed. Working on Nissans is like a puzzle. You need to remove 787 pieces to access one simple item. Ford copied this for the Rangers damn oil filter.

I'd go Ranger for now, it seems that they have learned from their global trucks. Then Zr2 if they weren't so expensive.

The Gladiator should be in this discussion, but it's still expensive as well. And only looks good on 37" tires. OEM's are remarkably ugly. Where's the hemi? Where's my manual transmission? It's still a Jeep with no engine, until someone proves the diesel.

I'm considering full size trucks I'm only going to bring camping equipment, a full size spare, & maybe soil amendments, & maybe a motorcycle.

I'm very interested to know more about your comment about gm build quality. Care to elaborate?

 

[MidOH]

I used to be a GM guy. They always left me wanting. Cheap quality everything. Noisy interior. Weak front diff, suspension. Low ride height. Unreliable. Haven't looked back since.

The guys in our groups with GM's generally have the most issues. (Except the ZR2's which do well) They just don't seem to care about people like us.

Our GM work trucks generally have reliable engines. But weak transmissions, with lazy shift patterns. Every cost corner cut. No trans cooler stock, for example. The body/light controller often becomes possessed by the debil and starts blinking like a wig wag cop car. And GM never makes a base model dash board. They just give you a dash with a hundred holes in it. "To remind you of all the options that you're too poor to have''. Ford and Ram have nice smooth dashes in the base models. I'll quit before working out of a GM again. Too much lost productivity due to down time. (it takes me 8 hours to move into another truck)

 

[Renaissance_Man]

I just found out today that there's an extra cost for owning & operating an f150 because "plaqué" which is the limit of my French but I think means that it cost more at our equivalent of the DMV or it means that its a heavier steel.

I forgot to mention that I'll only ever put camping equipment (we sleep in hammocks) in the bed, maybe a motocross motorcycle and maybe soil amendments for a small farm.

I'd also be interested to know which is easier to repair yourself. I did an electronics course, know how to flash firmware and I'm very handy; however I have no experience with fixing & or modifying vehicles.

Lastly I'm not interested in how a vehicle looks & I'll probably make it less flashy because I'm not a flashy guy

 

[Wawa Skittletits]

So I went to a Chevy dealership today to ask among other questions today, "What makes Chevy pickups special?".

He answered me that he can't put down Ford & every manufacturer has their advantages & disadvantages. I'm very disappointed with his answer.

I’m still trying to figure out what is wrong with this honest answer…. Hell I wish I could get a dealer to be that truthful haha. Spend 5 minutes looking at midsize trucks and you’ll realize just how fair that statement was. The entire segment is chock full of oddities with no single truck offering everything you’d want.