Pioneer I
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- Dave
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- Spinks
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3057
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- Royal Navy Veteran
Are these licence free as I thought in the UK licence free is restricted to 0.5 Watts?
Best UK Comms?
- Thread starter AceofAxe
- Start date
Inventor I
Only with no licence.
Business Licence, £75 for 5 years... ;) You just have to program them. To meet the requirement's.. I never said they were perfect and trees have good signal absorption properties. ;) ;)
Contributor II
To shed a little more light on the license exempt side of things, specific requirements have to be met and in particular on the 446MHz allocation its 0.5Watts ERP rather than 0.5Watts at the output stage of the radio. ERP (Effective Radiated Power) takes into account the loss or gain of an antenna.
For the radio detailed in the preceeding posts there are no licence exemptions that apply. So a licence is required for any transmission operation of the set.
There is also the additional requirement on the 446MHz allocation that the antenna must be non-removable by the user, so if you can remove the antenna in any way (without resorting to opening the set etc...) then the set itself is not compliant and legally cannot be used on the license free allocation.
In effect the 446MHz frequency allocation is not licence free but may be used without a licence if the equipment meets specific requirements. The Baofeng sets do not meet this requirement.
Rules and regulations for Wireless Telephony are a minefield.
This link is the current Ofcom position on licence exempt operation for 446MHz https://www.ofcom.org.uk/__data/assets/pdf_file/0025/85156/ir_2009_analogue_and_digita1.pdf
For some additional bedtime reading see the following for licence exemption in the UK Wireless Telegraphy Exemption Regulations
For the radio detailed in the preceeding posts there are no licence exemptions that apply. So a licence is required for any transmission operation of the set.
There is also the additional requirement on the 446MHz allocation that the antenna must be non-removable by the user, so if you can remove the antenna in any way (without resorting to opening the set etc...) then the set itself is not compliant and legally cannot be used on the license free allocation.
In effect the 446MHz frequency allocation is not licence free but may be used without a licence if the equipment meets specific requirements. The Baofeng sets do not meet this requirement.
Rules and regulations for Wireless Telephony are a minefield.
This link is the current Ofcom position on licence exempt operation for 446MHz https://www.ofcom.org.uk/__data/assets/pdf_file/0025/85156/ir_2009_analogue_and_digita1.pdf
For some additional bedtime reading see the following for licence exemption in the UK Wireless Telegraphy Exemption Regulations
Inventor I
Other than the business license, you can join a club and earn your right that way to i believe..
Pioneer I
- 11,171
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- Dave
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- Spinks
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3057
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What ever the preference for vehicle / trip comms it should be legally held and if training and a licence is required that is the correct route to take.
Rules are in place for very good reasons and we don't condone breaking them.
Also remember the radio route you decide to take can in different countries have different rules.
I have CB Radio simply because what I have is licence free in the UK and Europe and is easily available.
In Morocco CB Radios are not legal but PMR446 radios can be used so we sorted a pack to share out with our group when we visited in 2017.
Whether or not a Moroccan official for instance would recognise the difference is another issue but following the law and rules is the right way to do things.
Its always good to research what is allowed in countries you intend to visit. Drones in Morocco are a big no no and will be confiscated. Satellite phones in Russia and India are not allowed and monitored.
Rules are in place for very good reasons and we don't condone breaking them.
Also remember the radio route you decide to take can in different countries have different rules.
I have CB Radio simply because what I have is licence free in the UK and Europe and is easily available.
In Morocco CB Radios are not legal but PMR446 radios can be used so we sorted a pack to share out with our group when we visited in 2017.
Whether or not a Moroccan official for instance would recognise the difference is another issue but following the law and rules is the right way to do things.
Its always good to research what is allowed in countries you intend to visit. Drones in Morocco are a big no no and will be confiscated. Satellite phones in Russia and India are not allowed and monitored.
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Contributor II
I've use 446MHz radios with great success on trips.
In fact they are so mass produced and widely available you will almost certainly find one to suit your taste and budget from cheap literally disposable supermarket offerings to expensive rugged waterproof sets. All easy to operate and various battery options.
Unlike business licence sets, ham radio and CB you've not got the worries about blowing the output stage with a mismatched antenna and any amount can be deployed on a trip with anyone using them. I actually prefer them to ham radio for this very reason.
Great range on the open hills, reasonable range in urban settings and even reasonable range in convoy too.
In fact they are so mass produced and widely available you will almost certainly find one to suit your taste and budget from cheap literally disposable supermarket offerings to expensive rugged waterproof sets. All easy to operate and various battery options.
Unlike business licence sets, ham radio and CB you've not got the worries about blowing the output stage with a mismatched antenna and any amount can be deployed on a trip with anyone using them. I actually prefer them to ham radio for this very reason.
Great range on the open hills, reasonable range in urban settings and even reasonable range in convoy too.
Inventor I
The reason we use the PMR Band now, is simple. Easy access to the equipment for everybody.. They are £10 in Argos and standard across Europe, if you wreck one you just go and get another and the battery life is good.. Having the business license allows the use of the higher powered radio's.. upto 5 Watts handheld and upto 25 Watts in a base station setup.
CB' while now unlicensed upto 4 Watts and has great coverage etc is just expensive. The cheapest handheld being £70 ish.. Not as accessible to the masses. And the good units are expensive.
Last long dist trip we did was to Poland, when we got stopped by the police as you do (for no reason) it was just question after quest about the CB's even though CEPT etc. The police there did'nt have the knowledge at the ground level fully, where as they just ignore the PMR radio's as they are everywhere and a more common site.
Its not like we didnt blend in :) We basically took to old Jeep, tarted them up and run to Poland and back.. We still have the XJ just the ZJ was used with out shall I say permission and met a demise in the end bit if a shame really as they looked good..
CB' while now unlicensed upto 4 Watts and has great coverage etc is just expensive. The cheapest handheld being £70 ish.. Not as accessible to the masses. And the good units are expensive.
Last long dist trip we did was to Poland, when we got stopped by the police as you do (for no reason) it was just question after quest about the CB's even though CEPT etc. The police there did'nt have the knowledge at the ground level fully, where as they just ignore the PMR radio's as they are everywhere and a more common site.
Its not like we didnt blend in :) We basically took to old Jeep, tarted them up and run to Poland and back.. We still have the XJ just the ZJ was used with out shall I say permission and met a demise in the end bit if a shame really as they looked good..
Contributor II
Loving the Cherokee.
Found one in a yard of a mate that belonged to a mechanic who had upped and left suddenly. No keys or paperwork and a few bits missing in the engine bay. Thought about it for a few weeks as the interior was good and the bodywork was sound too (sprayed a matt olive drab).
Lack of knowledge on this vehicle and its imobiliser pretty much decided it for me unfortunately despite the attractive looks so I reluctantly gave it a miss.
Sorry for going off topic...
Found one in a yard of a mate that belonged to a mechanic who had upped and left suddenly. No keys or paperwork and a few bits missing in the engine bay. Thought about it for a few weeks as the interior was good and the bodywork was sound too (sprayed a matt olive drab).
Lack of knowledge on this vehicle and its imobiliser pretty much decided it for me unfortunately despite the attractive looks so I reluctantly gave it a miss.
Sorry for going off topic...
Inventor I
They are great, go any anywhere and fun trucks to own, just thirsty is the name of the day.. I can get about 14 MPG on a good day with polar bears blessing me.
the 4.0 is bullet proof to 250k if you treat it to regular dino oil and look after the basic's, min is 20 years old and starts on the button and just purrs.
the 4.0 is bullet proof to 250k if you treat it to regular dino oil and look after the basic's, min is 20 years old and starts on the button and just purrs.
Enthusiast III
- 616
- First Name
- Paul
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- Wilkinson
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17317
Just dragging this thread back up.
Does OB Western Europe / UK have a set standard now that we should be working to?
I have a Baofeng UV82 PMR setup I previously had set up for a local 4x4 Response group (don't ask - committees are the bane of any organisation!) and woulkd love to reprogram it for OB use.
Does OB Western Europe / UK have a set standard now that we should be working to?
I have a Baofeng UV82 PMR setup I previously had set up for a local 4x4 Response group (don't ask - committees are the bane of any organisation!) and woulkd love to reprogram it for OB use.
Pathfinder III
- 5,200
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- Kent
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- Reynolds
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1632
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@Polaris Overland, can you or one of the local Member Reps help this member?
Pioneer I
- 11,171
- First Name
- Dave
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- Spinks
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3057
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Hiya Paul,
Generally in the UK it is still CB or license free PMR and these are used predominantly for convoy work and spotting where range is not an issue.
We have both CB and PMR. THE CB radios are 1 fixed in the Landy and 1 handheld that floats between vehicles. We also have 2 x PMR Handhelds which to be honest have been used more by the grandkids to find them.
I think if you intend to go further afield than the UK then Ham Radio options are much more in use in the likes of the EU Regions and they will be able to confirm what regions use which frequencies.
Good to see you back by the way.
Enthusiast III
- 616
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17317
Thanks Dave,
My PMR is currently programmed for the 4x4 Response group but I will get it deprogrammed. Are there any specific channels I should get it programmed for or just the stock setup?
My PMR is currently programmed for the 4x4 Response group but I will get it deprogrammed. Are there any specific channels I should get it programmed for or just the stock setup?
Off-Road Ranger III
- 13,288
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- Eldracher
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20111
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In Europe most overlanders and offroaders still use CB radio (11m band) or as Dave also already wrote PMR446 (with all its disadvantages). However, HAM radio is also on the rise in this area. Because it simply offers many advantages, possibilities and is also a great hobby.
The regulations might be different from country to country. In the UK you have three license classes, with the right to different technical possibilities and also different learning requirements. In Germany, for example, we have only two so far - a pure beginner and user class is to come. In mobile comms often the 2m or 70 cm band is used. Commonly used voice calling frequencies in Europe are 433.500 MHz on 70cm and 145.500 MHz on 2m.
If you want to dive deeper into the subject, it is always worthwhile to look at the page of the local authority/ regulator. For the UK, this is the OFCOM. On their website you can find a lot of information about amateur radio in the UK:
www.ofcom.org.uk
I would say it's worth looking into. But of course it's also important that you choose the radio application that most of the people you're traveling with have.
The regulations might be different from country to country. In the UK you have three license classes, with the right to different technical possibilities and also different learning requirements. In Germany, for example, we have only two so far - a pure beginner and user class is to come. In mobile comms often the 2m or 70 cm band is used. Commonly used voice calling frequencies in Europe are 433.500 MHz on 70cm and 145.500 MHz on 2m.
If you want to dive deeper into the subject, it is always worthwhile to look at the page of the local authority/ regulator. For the UK, this is the OFCOM. On their website you can find a lot of information about amateur radio in the UK:
Information for amateur radio licensees
Guidance for amateur radio users, sometimes known as ham radio, which is both a hobby and a service that uses various types of radio equipment.
I would say it's worth looking into. But of course it's also important that you choose the radio application that most of the people you're traveling with have.
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Enthusiast III
- 616
- First Name
- Paul
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- Wilkinson
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17317
Had another look and my unit is a Baofeng UV82. I picked up a dual band aerial and mic/speaker setup to make it more rig friendly. Do ppl ook these up to an external aerial when inside a rig or have a dedicated unit for that?
Pioneer I
- 11,171
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- Spinks
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3057
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In the Landy we have a fixed Base Unit and we use the Handheld in the Van
Enthusiast III
- 616
- First Name
- Paul
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- Wilkinson
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17317
I suppose most of the time they are used for convoy/site purposes so a handheld is fine. Maybe a fixed unit would be overkill at the moment.
Better to spend the effort mounting it and setting it up properly.
Better to spend the effort mounting it and setting it up properly.
