APRS - 710GA vs 400XDR

[weiln12]

All,

I’m a newbie, just got my license today. I’m very interested in APRS and using that to communicate with other overlanders as well as provide a way for myself and family to track me when I’m out in the middle of nowhere in Arizona. The concept of being “plugged in” is seriously cool, especially knowing I can leverage some satellites if I’m out of digipeater/repeater range.

The club hosting the test is all very much a Yaesu group and were heavily pushing Yaesu. They have Fusion repeaters up all over the valley and up to Flagstaff and are setting up WIRES-X as well. They showed me their setups and it all works really well, but I’m not convinced the Yaesu is the direction I want to go in.

Prior to seeing their rigs I was leaning towards the 710GA for the primary reason that you can access the TNC. The Yaesu doesn’t allow this and I’m concerned that will limit my options to interact with the radio and do cool “things” like live maps via a tablet and such.

I’ve also looked at other options like getting a 71A or 8900 to go along with a TNC3/iPad, but I’m not sure that would get me anything and it wouldn’t be worth the hassle. I’m also not convinced it would really be any cheaper than the 710GA/400XDR.

I really want to have a constant APRS channel, I’m just not sure the best way to do all this. The Kenwood seems like the best option overall, but it is pricey. I know any of these radios are overkill for a newbie, but I‘d rather understand that and overbuy now instead of having to re-buy in a year or two. Would I be giving up a lot of compatibility with the local group using Yaesu and would that be worth the extra options for APRS with the Kenwood? Am I overthinking all of this?

Am I going in the wrong direction, or am I missing something?

 

[Prerunner1982]

Congrats on getting licensed.
The Yaesu is quite popular due to the price, but it does appear the 710G does it better for the reason you mentioned.
I on the other hand pieced my setup together as I could afford it. At the time I got licensed I either wasn't aware of APRS or it wasn't in the budget or maybe both.
I go a nice Yaesu FT-8800r dual band mobile.
Later I tried APRS using a TNC2.1 and a baofeng handheld but wasn't happy with it so I purchased a Yaesu FTM-3100 2m specifically for APRS using the TNC2.1 and Android tablet.
So now I have a dual band for voice so I can still monitor more than once frequency and I have a dedicated APRS radio just doing it's own thing.
Yes it's an extra radio but I like the way it turned out and the capability that I have with it.

 

[weiln12]

That's actually a really good point. While the 8800r isn't available anymore, the 8900r is and it's a quad-band. Would the additional 29/50MHz bands be beneficial, or would I end up not using them? The price of the FT-8900r is better, it's a decent chunk of change cheaper than the 710GA/400XDR and I get two additional bands. And to your point I can pick up a single-channel 2m just for APRS later.

But that doesn't help me with the "I WANT ALL THE TOYS NOW!!!" :)

 

[Prerunner1982]

As a Technician your 10m privileges are for SSB, the 8900r is FM only. While there is some activity on 10m and 6m FM much of it is SSB. Quadband antennas are few and not the most efficient. I wouldn't get it specifically because it's a quad band but it would make an adequate dual band.

 

[weiln12]

That’s a good point. My primary purpose would be for APRS, secondary would be for communicating while out in a group. Most groups run GMRS, so my GMRS radio would be used mostly. For this reason, I’m heavily leaning towards the FTM-100DR which appears to be the best option for price and APRS and would still allow me to use it for communication.

I’m trying to validate my desire for APRS using a Baofeng HT and my iPad with the cable. I’m getting a better antenna today, but so far I haven’t been able to get the iPad to process any APRS packets. I’m thinking it’s due to the signal strength and the new antenna will help. I read another ham had the same issue with the TNC3 and an antenna fixed the issue.

I guess the whole point is that APRS is only relevant to me if it works out in the desert. Which it should given that most digipeaters are on mountains and the desert floor usually has decent line of sight.

 

[1Louder]

I have had a 710 for years and love it. Can’t speak to anything Yeasu other than My handheld. Ken wood is very easy to use. I have never tried to do external mapping. Not that important to me. I could always drop a waypoint in Gaia GPS of another user if need be It is not easy to text from the Kenwood but people can send messages to you via the web pretty easily.

 

[weiln12]

I'm not worried about the external mapping as much as I am family/friends knowing where I am and being able to contact them in the event things go sideways. To your point, Gaia can tell me exactly where I am and I prefer that for mapping. APRS appears to be a more flexible and significantly cheaper mechanism for sharing my location while out and about than satellite trackers.

Of course this is new to me so I could be misunderstanding the options and capabilities, as well as the implementations.

 

[1Louder]

I haven't watched this yet but maybe there is some good general info.

I prefer my InReach but APRS works well. You are just broadcasting your location to the masses.

 

[Prerunner1982]

That’s a good point. My primary purpose would be for APRS, secondary would be for communicating while out in a group. Most groups run GMRS, so my GMRS radio would be used mostly. For this reason, I’m heavily leaning towards the FTM-100DR which appears to be the best option for price and APRS and would still allow me to use it for communication.

I’m trying to validate my desire for APRS using a Baofeng HT and my iPad with the cable. I’m getting a better antenna today, but so far I haven’t been able to get the iPad to process any APRS packets. I’m thinking it’s due to the signal strength and the new antenna will help. I read another ham had the same issue with the TNC3 and an antenna fixed the issue.

The FTM-100 does APRS or Voice but does not do both... or at least very well. Sounds like that might work fine for you though.

I tried the Baofeng APRS route and was not impressed by it even with different external antennas. I switched to a 2m mobile radio and it works much better.

Of course this is new to me so I could be misunderstanding the options and capabilities, as well as the implementations.

APRS and it's ability to show your position on a webpage and pass messages depends entirely on a user provided infrastructure.
Unfortunately there are many areas that don't have much or any APRS coverage.

 

[Todd & Meg]

I'm not worried about the external mapping as much as I am family/friends knowing where I am and being able to contact them in the event things go sideways. To your point, Gaia can tell me exactly where I am and I prefer that for mapping. APRS appears to be a more flexible and significantly cheaper mechanism for sharing my location while out and about than satellite trackers.

Of course this is new to me so I could be misunderstanding the options and capabilities, as well as the implementations.

A few months ago I had the same thinking as you have now. I don't have my license yet, but have been working on it and can never get to take the test. But I was looking for a way so our grown kids can follow us and contact us if they needed to. I thought APRS was going to be it. But it seems like everything it can do had short comings. I went with an InReach Mini and have been mostly happy with it. We can send messages and the kids can see where we are on a map, and they can send us messages. That sounds like what you are looking to do.

I found it creepy you can track people on the APRS.FI map and see where they have been over the last few days, to their work, house, everywhere. Maybe there is a way to turn it off, or who can track you but I don't know.

When I can have an APRS layer in Gaia and have it show me the people I'm on a trip with in real time I'll look into it again.

Todd

 

[1Louder]

I found it creepy you can track people on the APRS.FI map and see where they have been over the last few days, to their work, house, everywhere. Maybe there is a way to turn it off, or who can track you but I don't know.

When I can have an APRS layer in Gaia and have it show me the people I'm on a trip with in real time I'll look into it again.

Todd

Public airwaves and public data. I agree with you although I still use it sometimes. I don't think Gaia will ever get an APRS layer. We have talked about it for years.

 

[RockyMountaineer]

All,

I’m a newbie, just got my license today. I’m very interested in APRS and using that to communicate with other overlanders as well as provide a way for myself and family to track me when I’m out in the middle of nowhere in Arizona. The concept of being “plugged in” is seriously cool, especially knowing I can leverage some satellites if I’m out of digipeater/repeater range.

The club hosting the test is all very much a Yaesu group and were heavily pushing Yaesu. They have Fusion repeaters up all over the valley and up to Flagstaff and are setting up WIRES-X as well. They showed me their setups and it all works really well, but I’m not convinced the Yaesu is the direction I want to go in.

Prior to seeing their rigs I was leaning towards the 710GA for the primary reason that you can access the TNC. The Yaesu doesn’t allow this and I’m concerned that will limit my options to interact with the radio and do cool “things” like live maps via a tablet and such.

I’ve also looked at other options like getting a 71A or 8900 to go along with a TNC3/iPad, but I’m not sure that would get me anything and it wouldn’t be worth the hassle. I’m also not convinced it would really be any cheaper than the 710GA/400XDR.

I really want to have a constant APRS channel, I’m just not sure the best way to do all this. The Kenwood seems like the best option overall, but it is pricey. I know any of these radios are overkill for a newbie, but I‘d rather understand that and overbuy now instead of having to re-buy in a year or two. Would I be giving up a lot of compatibility with the local group using Yaesu and would that be worth the extra options for APRS with the Kenwood? Am I overthinking all of this?

Am I going in the wrong direction, or am I missing something?

So just something to look at. There is an app call APRSdroid that links via bluetooth to your radio. It works well for my FT3D so in theory it should work with the 400XDR.

 

[Downs]

My APRS setup is a handheld attached to an external antenna. It's not something I keep on the Jeep all the time just on trip so being battery powered isn't a huge deal.

Baofeng, BTECH APRS cable and a 40 dollar android phone from amazon. The setup is hooked to an external 1/4 wave antenna. It's pretty impressive how far your packets can travel sometimes even with a basic setup. A permanant setup built into the mobile would be great but those radios are expensive.

 

[TerryD]

I'm not worried about the external mapping as much as I am family/friends knowing where I am and being able to contact them in the event things go sideways. To your point, Gaia can tell me exactly where I am and I prefer that for mapping. APRS appears to be a more flexible and significantly cheaper mechanism for sharing my location while out and about than satellite trackers.

Of course this is new to me so I could be misunderstanding the options and capabilities, as well as the implementations.

APRS was originally developed for use in situations where passing messages was important before texting was a thing. You can also send e-mails and text messages through it if there is an i-gate within digi-peated range of you. Most modern radios will display the distance to the received station's location on the faceplate when the packet is received. A fellow member and I were running APRS on an OB trip and with him near the front and me near the rear of the group, we could see how far the group was spreading out.

On my trip to Colorado this year I was able to send messages to my wife back home when we were staying somewhere out of cell service for the night and to let her know I was still doing ok.

 

[TerryD]

I bought the TM-D710Ga last year and installed it in my Xterra. It's been a great radio. Not only is APRS a neat thing to play with, but when I'm not running it I can actively monitor two frequencies at the same time.

The added TNC access in the 710 was a draw for me plus I'm a big fan of Kenwood mobile radios over the two Yaesu mobiles I've owned.

I like my 710 so much that I ordered an 2nd one to install in my pickup soon.

 

[RockyMountaineer]

Just for further information.

 

[HuddExpo]

I have been running my 400 for a couple of years and I absolutely love it. I run APRS on the B band 100% of the time. No need for any other widgets, etc, it just works all the time and very good. The touchscreen display makes texting, etc. very easy. The A band I use for regular comms when out and about.

FWIW, I have never had the desire to have TNC connection on this unit. Mapping is for mapping software, like Gaiagps.

 

[RockyMountaineer]

I have been running my 400 for a couple of years and I absolutely love it. I run APRS on the B band 100% of the time. No need for any other widgets, etc, it just works all the time and very good. The touchscreen display makes texting, etc. very easy. The A band I use for regular comms when out and about.

FWIW, I have never had the desire to have TNC connection on this unit. Mapping is for mapping software, like Gaiagps.

They only advantage for using the APRS and the TNC for mapping to keep track of other vehicles/people in a group. Outside that there really is no need for it.